Jacob Siegel - Parents - 2024 Discussion

Lots and lots of work went into untangling Siegel families in 2023.
See https://www.geni.com/discussions/266181

Then on Aug. 26, 2024, Jacob's mother was disconnected and set afloat. "Leah "Alte" Siegel" = Leah Siegel

And Jacob's father's name was changed from Arye Abba Siegel, HaKohen to Abraham Jacob Siegel, HaKohen and currently appears as Abraham Jacob Siegel - Abraham Jacob Siegel
Arye Abba Siegel, HaKohen's profile was updated by M. Siegel-Bloom. birth, death, first name, and middle name« less / Mon

And Jacob's father's other wife and their children were cut off and set afloat, fortunately still connected
Abraham Jacob Siegel, HaKohen was disconnected from his wife Rachel Leah (Pearlman) Siegel and children Philip Siegel and Barnet / Benjamin Siegel by M. Siegel-Bloom. / Mon
Rachel Leah Siegel

And Leah (Weiss) Siegel was added as Jacob's mother - that is Leah Siegel
Leah (Weiss) Siegel was added as Abraham Jacob Siegel, HaKohen's wife by M. Siegel-Bloom. / Mon
Leah Siegel

Some info on Jacob's parents found in his Death Record and Gravestone:

Jacob's Death Record -- https://www.geni.com/documents/view?doc_id=6000000194887415852&... -- has:
Father's Birth Place: Russia
Mother's Birth Place: Russia
Father: Harry Siegel
Mother: Leah Siegel
And confirming it is this person, it also had:
Informant: Belle Morafky
Informant Gender: Female
Informant Relationship: Daughter
Executor: Mary Siegel
Executor Relationship: Wife

In Hebrew on his Gravestone Jacob's name is given as [Ben-Tzion Yakov] son of [Aryeh Aba]
https://www.geni.com/photo/view?photo_id=6000000085125074843

--JOWBR has SIEGEL, Jacob -- Place of Death: Bronx, NY -- Date of Desth: 02-Aug-1947 -- Hebrew Name: Ben-Tzion Yakov b. Aryeh Abba. -- Age: 64 -- Spouse: Mary -- Father: Harry -- Mother: Leah -- Comments: "beloved husband and dear father/brother of Philip" -- Mt. Hebron Cemetery / Kovner Young Men / Block 28, Path 2 - in Queens, NY

There is a good chance Jacob = Jankel Bentsel Libes
Civil Marriages were expensive, so often Jews did the Religious Marriage but not the Civil - in which case the children officially went by the Mother's Birth Surname until and unless the Parents got married.
[NY Death Record does not contain a Surname for either Parent]

If so, then Jacob's Marriage Record may be on JewishGen / Litvak Sig in Lithuania Marriages:
LIBES, Iankel Bentsel -- Age 26 -- Place: Vilijampole -- Father: Abel
POTOSHCHIK, Mera -- Age 22 -- Place: Vilijampole -- Father: Gerts
Marriage -- on 20 - Apr - 1904 - 18 Iyar 5664 -- in Kaunas / Kaunas / Kaunas
Witnesses: 1 Iankel Gersh SHMUILOVICH -- 2 Movsha Itsyk KHASES

--In a letter by Rudy Drosd to other family members, including the mother of :Steven Albert who shared it with me
"Mary married Jake Siegel in Europe -- they lived in New York."

I know that Belle makes up about Harry. 23andME is right based on my Siegel cousins for AJSiegel. I see my cousins are related to AJS. NO Connection to Aryeh Abba.

Note: To accept that as his Marriage:
There are reasons to believe the Siegel family went by Libes before coming to the US,
and that the Bloom family went by Potashchik before coming to the US.
For a discussion of the latter see: https://www.geni.com/discussions/265938

And the Gravestones of Jacob and Mary https://www.geni.com/photo/view?photo_id=6000000085125074843 show Mary's name in Hebrew as
[Merka] daughter of the revered [Hertzl] - show very likely she is POTOSHCHIK, Mera
And 'G' and 'H' are interchangeable in Lithuanian names, so Gerts = Herts

this is NO DNA MATCHES to Harry Siegel or other.

I have a lot of cousins who are related to AJS by DNA matches.

I am guessing AJS is for Abraham Jacob Siegel.

yes

My mom told me about Arthur Siegel and Herbert Lawrence Herman (Death certificate) I told you that some documents are FRAUD. DNA does not LIE period I am not interested in HEARSAY

Abraham Jacob Siegel

Private

Me, Leslie and Jason are related to Darcy Heller

Jason is related to Abraham's fourth great grandson (AJS)

My Heritage and 23andME are Right! my 2nd cousin's great grandson is Jason

Forgot to mention in https://www.geni.com/discussions/282703?msg=1718323
For that Death Record of Jacob - further verifying it is for the same Jacob - The address for Jacob on that Death Cert. is the same as on his WWII Draft Reg. = https://www.geni.com/documents/view?doc_id=6000000194888666829&... - 2075 Walton Ave in NYC (on 1940 Census they are living near there at 2071 Walton)

Perhaps helping understand cimments in https://www.geni.com/discussions/282703?msg=1718324
The Death Record we believed to be for Jacob's father -- https://www.geni.com/documents/view?doc_id=6000000194894294838&.... - has his father's name as "Aria Siegel" and his father's parents as Father: Hirsh Siegel and Maiden Name of Mother: Sarah Libes

Private User
I appreciate you attempting to explain why you made the changes you did.

I have asked in ATTENTION Curators, please assist to have a Curator take part in the discussion and/or decide.
I do not know if any will.

You are correct that DNA does not LIE - BUT it is very often MIS-INTERPRETED.

I believe 23andME and MyHertiage are right based on my DNA match cousins. I am interested in DNA match cousins than the documents and//or HEARSAY from any family. I see my half second cousin who have MyHertiage, Ancestry, and Geni. I did not like Fake Aria or Harry or Arthur from my family HEARSAY I know a lot of the documents are same names as Harry or Arthur or Aria.

LOOK at Arthur Nachman and my daughter A. Rose and my mom put "A' over Rabbi Arthur Siegel 104 years old I was looking for it in 4 years. NO DNA connections