Who is correct, Vivian or Bodine concerning Oliver's father?
Vivian states the father of Oliver was John Champernowne
The visitations of the county of Devon : Comprising the herald's visitations of 1531, 1564, & 1620 / With additions by Lieutenant-Colonel J. L. Vivian
https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=yale.39002002213917&seq=...
According to Vivian's pedigree chart pg 160
Oliver Champernowne married Eglina, da. and coh. of Hugh de Valletort.
Oliver's parents were John and Unknown
John's parents were William d. 1301 and Johane Unknown
William's parents were Henry living 1272 and Dionisa English
Henry's parents were Oliver and Eva
Oliver's parents were Henry and Rohais
An alternative pedigree suggests Oliver Champernowne was the son of Richard Champernowne of Modbury and Joan Cornwall, and a brother to Richard Champernowne who was married to Elizabeth de Valletort, sister to Oliver's wife Eglina. This alternative may have come from Ronnie Bodine in the 90's, who made several posts on soc.genealogy.medieval about the Champernouns, claiming Vivian was incorrect.
https://groups.google.com/g/soc.genealogy.medieval/c/Lz5tSilfCm8/m/...
"Yes, Oliver of Tawton, husband of Egeline de Valletort, in my opinion
and that of Todd, was the brother of Sir Richard of Modbury (died 1338),
husband of Elizabeth de Valletort."
https://groups.google.com/g/soc.genealogy.medieval/c/v_haextevxU/m/...
https://groups.google.com/g/soc.genealogy.medieval/c/hWEOutYTTZI/m/...
https://groups.google.com/g/soc.genealogy.medieval/c/kGcdGTaudko/m/...
In that last post, Mr. Bodine states "However, insofar as Sir William's son John was a
cleric whose church career covered the period from 1309 until his death in
1335, it does not seem likely that he was Oliver's father."
This has been picked up by many sites.
https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Champernoun-27
Oliver Champernon formerly Champernoun
Born 1290 in Modbury, Devon, England
Ancestors
Son of Richard (Champernon) Champernoun and Joan Cornwall
Brother of Hugh De Todesford, Richard Champernon and Margaret Champernon
Husband of Eglina (Valletort) Champernoun
[cites Wikipedia, Joan Cornwall had a son Richard Champernoun. No mention of an Oliver there]
http://www.tudorplace.com.ar/CHAMPERNOWNE.htm
Oliver CHAMPERNOWNE
Born: ABT 1300
Died: AFT 1340
Father: Richard CHAMPERNOWNE of Modbury (Sir) / John CHAMPERNOWNE
Mother: Joan De CORNWALL / ¿?
Married: Eglina VALLETORT (b. ABT 1264/1280) (dau. of Ralph (Edmund) (Hugh) Valletort of Trematon and ¿?) ABT 1327?
[also gives John Champernowne, a cleric, as a possible father]
https://fabpedigree.com/s022/f094311.htm
Oliver de CHAMPERNON
aka Otho CHAMPERNOWNE
Born: North Tawnton, Devon Died: aft. 1340
Wife/Partner: Egelina de VALLETORT
FATHER
Richard (Sir; of Modbury) CHAMPERNOUN (CHAMBERNON)
MOTHER
Joan (Bastard) of MODBURY dau of Richard Plantagenet
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/199650527/joan-de_cornwall
Daughter of Richard PLANTAGENET 1st Earl of Cornwall and Joan VAUTORT
Wife of Richard CHAPENOWNE
Mother of Oliver CHAMPERNOWNE and Richard CHAMPERNOWNE of Modbury
Was Oliver the brother of Richard, son of Joan Cornwall?
Collections towards a description of the county of Devon. By Sir William Pole, ... now first printed from the autograph in the possession of his lineal descendant Sir John-William de la Pole, Bart. ... 1791
https://archive.org/details/bim_eighteenth-century_collections-towa...
No mention of Richard having a brother Oliver. Either Oliver was not worthy of mention, or wasn't his brother.
pg 309 states Alexander de Okeston m. Jone, the widowe of Raph de Valletort, which woaman (as it is probable) was the concubine of Richard Erle of Cornwall . . . ; they had issue Sir James de Okeston which died without issue; . . . Kinge Edw.2 [hee] conveyed Modbiry . . unto Sir Richard Chambernon, which was sonne of Richard Champernoun, & Jone, daughter of Jone before mentioned . . . The said Richard the father was younger sonne of Sir Henry Chambernon, of Clift Chambernon.
Sir Richard Chambernon, . . . had issue Sir Richrd of Modbiry, which by Elisabeth, da. & on [of] the heirs of Hugh de Valletort . . .
A genealogical and heraldic history of the commoners of Great Britain and Ireland enjoying territorial possessions or high official rank; but uninvested with heritable https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=nyp.33433081849212&view=.... By John Burke ... v. 2
No mention of Richard having a brother Oliver. Either Oliver was not worthy of mention, or wasn't his brother.
pg 271 States Richard Chambernoun, son of Henry, married Joan Cornwall.
They had Sir Richard Chambernon.
He had Richard Chambernon, of Modbury, who m. Elizabeth, dau and co-heir of Hugh de Valletort, of Tawton, and was father of Sir Thomas Champernon.
1) Can anyone find a reliable source that John, son of William and Johane, was a childless cleric, and thus could not be the father of Oliver?
2) Vivian states Oliver's wife was dau of Hugh de Valletort, and Richard's wife was dau of Ralph de Valetort. Not an example of brothers marrying sisters as Mr. Bodine claimed. Can anyone find a source that Oliver was a brother of Richard, and they were both children of Richard Champernowne and Joan Cornwall?
