Richard Warren, "Mayflower" Passenger - Richard Warren, an original Mayflower participant

My 10th GGF :)

I really don't know for sure if Richard Warren was an ancestral Warren or not. I'm just reporting that my YDNA of E-FTB75291, matched Richard's and that we share a common male ancestor further back in time.

I'm also not sure how Family Tree DNA (FTDNA) knows that Richard's YDNA is E-FTB75291, like mine. I suspect though that one or more of the unknown persons from my original post, which shows there are 7 of us who share the E-Z21365 haplogroup, but 4 are unknown, must have been able to prove his ancestry to Richard Warren through a verified paper trail. Otherwise, how would FTDNA know?

If Richard or one of his direct male ancestors was a Haynor or not, is unknown to me, but FTDNA says there is a direct male ancestor connection. Unless FTDNA, made some type of mistake, which I find highly unlikely, it would seem to explain why, over time, it's been hard to find Richard's parents, because there apparently is no paper trail.

It's been reported that Richard was at least somewhat wealthy. I can find no wealth, nobility, or important standing at all in early Haynor English persons. It's been my experience through genealogy and ancestry research that persons of wealth/nobility are easier to track. So, why can't we find Richar's parents? English citizens/families back in those days were very stratified through their wealth or standing in society. Their cast in life was set from birth. If a family back then such as a Haynor family had a male child that they were unable to take care of, or if these parents died, some family would have had to take Richard in. Because of YDNA regarding Richard and me says we share a common male ancestor back in time, it's a high probability, that this is what happened. If not, what could possibly explain this finding?

On both ancestry.com and FTDNA, I have some matches with persons with the surname Warren. Whether these persons are somehow descended from Richard Warren is unknown to me.

My 10th GGF

GSMD approved Richard Warren via daughter Abigail via my father & Elizabeth via my mom

I am a descendant of 8 Mayflower passengers & Richard Warren was one of them and is my 10th Great Grandfather.
Gary Allen

Ed Haynor Does FTDNA require / verify paper trails, or can people enter lineages based on guesses? Ancestry.com, for instance, references the lineages people have provided and doesn't verify, so any "DNA Thrulines" links you get there may be suspect.

Not that it helps, but I'm in the process of substantiating my link to Richard Warren with GSMD through his daughter Mary Bartlett and my Comstock line. Ruth Comstock's brother's line has already been accepted so I just need to substantiate my link to their father Moses Comstock.

BTW, I live in Salem, MA so if there's anything you'd like me to take a look at here, I'm willing to try. There are a lot of records held by the Essex Institute that (I believe) are not digitized. I already checked and can confirm your William Haynor of Salem, MA is not buried in the Old Burying Point (Charter Street Cemetery), for which I have a newly published reference.

I don't believe that FTDNA gets involved in anything but DNA. At the bottom of their website it says, "Founded in 2000, FamilyTreeDNA pioneered the field of genetic genealogy—the use of DNA testing to establish relationships between individuals and determine ancestry. As leaders in the industry, we provide advanced technology for users to gain further insight into their family history—all with a simple swab of DNA. Over 2 million people have tested with FamilyTreeDNA, resulting in the most comprehensive DNA matching database in the industry." I believe that any person tested by FTDNA, who adds any personal information does so on their own. So, I guess that it's up to a person themselves to be trusted that the personal information they add, is correct as far as they know. I agree that ancestry.com has the same policy.

Good luck with your General Society of Mayflower Descendants project. I tried to join the Mayflower Project at FTDNA, but they wouldn't let me in because I'm not a descendant of Richard's, but share a common ancestor further back in time. I felt my involvement might further benefit the Warren and Haynor families, because if Richard or a male grandfather, great grandfather, etc., was really a Haynor, who got adopted or changed his surname, all the Warren family attached to Richard Warren would also be descendants of the Haynor family. It's interesting to note that Richard's haplogroup is "E" and so is mine. But there are few persons attached to the Warren Project at FTDNA who are of the haplogroup "E".

Thanks in advance for considering looking up "William Haynor" in Salem. I can only find him in Salem in 1660. Below is what I know of William Haynor:

(1) In the Genealogical Guide to the Early Settlers of America with a Brief History of Those of the First Generation, Vol. 2, by Henry Whittemore, believed published in 1924 at: http://archive.org/stream/cu31924095655571/cu31924095655571_djvu.txt, where in the year 1660, William Haynor, a tailor was located in Virginia. Actually, it is quoted here as, “HAYNOR, William, Salem, 1660, a tailor from Virginia. Felt.” The “Felt” reference apparently is to the Rev. Joseph B. Felt, the distinguished historian and annalist of Salem, Massachusetts.

(2) The second publication shows this listing somewhat differently in Americana, Volume 15, at: https://books.google.com/books?id=TGgKAQAAMAAJ&printsec=frontco...,” under the headline, Ancestral Heads of New England Families, where it says, “Haynor, William, tailor, came from Virginia to Salem, Mass., 1660.”

(3) William Haynor was found in A genealogical dictionary of the first settlers of New England, showing three generations of those who came before May, 1692, on the basis of Farmer's Register by Savage, James, 1784-1873; Making of America Project; Farmer, John, 1789-1838; Dexter, O. P. (Orrando Perry), 1854-1903, published in 1860 at https://archive.org/stream/genealogicaldic02savarich/genealogicaldi..., which lists on page 391, “HAYNOR, WILLIAM, Salem 1660, a tailor from Virg. Felt.” So, the author is interpreting this information on William Haynor to mean that a William Haynor likely emigrated to Virginia, possibly from the British Isles, and was found later in Salem, Massachusetts in the year 1660 and his occupation at that time was that of a tailor.

(4) In the publication titled, Annals of Salem, by Joseph B. Felt, Vol. 2, 2nd edition published in 1849 at: https://archive.org/stream/annalsofsalem18452felt/annalsofsalem1845..., states on page 182, “Tailors. 1652. Two men are fined by an Essex County Court for excess in dress, and three others for wearing silver lace, because not having sufficient property to sustain such expense. 1658. Edward Harnet. 1659. John Smith. 1660. William Robinson, Robert Temple, and William Haynor, the last from Virginia.” Since this publication states the following on page 12, “Entered, according to Act of Congress, in the year 1849, By Joseph B. Felt, In the Clerk's Office of the District Court of the District of Massachusetts,” the author believes the publication title, Annals of Salem, is about Salem, Massachusetts, not to be mistaken for Salem, Virginia.

The part about “Tailors. 1652. Two men are fined by an Essex County Court for excess in dress, and three others for wearing silver lace, because not having sufficient property to sustain such expense. 1658. Edward Harnet. 1659. John Smith. 1660. William Robinson, Robert Temple, and William Haynor, the last from Virginia,” I believe the part of being fined by a court for excess in dress, in 1660, as it applies to William Haynor likely means that he was a young back then when he was fined since it's likely that an adult "tailor" would not have made such a mistake.

(5) Directory of the Ancestral Heads of New England Families, 1620-1700, author Frank Holmes, New York, American historical Society, 1923. The author found this publication on ancestry.com, which says that William was born in 1620 and was found later in Massachusetts in 1660. Unfortunately, when the author clicked on the link, it brought up some of the same information on this William Haynor that was found before as: HAYNOR, William, tailor, came from Virginia to Salem, Mass., 1660. Nowhere in this publication can the author find where this William Haynor was born in 1620. So, how ancestry.com came up with this information, is unknown to this author. In regards to this citation by ancestry.com, they referenced a site called the Godfrey Memorial Library in Middletown, CT, where ancestry.com states further information can be found on this William Haynor in the Directory of Ancestral Heads of New England Families, by Frank Holmes, NY 1923. (274p.): 113, Vol. 76, pg. 164, listed under the title The American Genealogical-Biographic Index (AGBI). The author contacted the Godfrey Memorial Library and the information sent to this author revealed no additional information on this William Haynor.

I believe this Haynor family eventually moved to NY state and/or Canada, because I believe some were loyal to the Crown who moved to Canada, but anything you might find on William Haynor or any other Haynor, back then, would be much appreciated.