Edward Pat Bass - Y DNA conflict

Jeffrey Bass contributed DNA Markers: R-M269 details & it does not match the A M31 contributed by others.

His line is from Richard Bass Sr. Looks like it’s possible that man is not the son of John Basse Sr.

Mary Bass

Bass historians say her children’s Y DNA haplogroup is R1b, which is not the Bass haplogroup of L47.

Disconnecting from Richard Bass, Sr.

That solved it.

Capt. John Basse, Sr. Has a note: same as

Capt. John Basse, Sr.

Both show as wife of ‘Elizabeth’ Basse, of the Nansemond

Downstream is A, an African haplogroup.

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/102311921/nathaniel-basse

Nathaniel and Mary's children were: Humphrey (1615-1622), Samuel (twin of Humphrey), John (1616-1699), William (1618-1641), Anthony (b1620), Edward (1622-1696), Mary, Genevieve (b1624), Anne (twin to Genevieve), Richard (b1625), Gregory (b1628), George (twin of Gregory).

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/173299826/john-basse

Capt. John Basse (1616 - 1699) (son of Nathaniel Basse 1589–1655 & Mary Jourdan Basse 1591–1629)

“Born coming over from England to Michigan [SIC] USA Married Norfolk Va.”

Married to https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/173299758/keziah-elizabeth-basse

Is this correct?

Are we sure of the name of the father of William “elder” Bass, Sr.

And does he really have siblings? If not, I think he’s the only A and Capt John Basse (Son of Nathaniel of England) has unknown wife.

Per Bob Barris

https://www.geni.com/discussions/221944?msg=1436526

The parents of William are a well known fact even though we do not know his African fathers name. William is the beginning of the rare A Hap group, A M31 V25 in the Bass family, all modern day members of the Nansemond tribe descend from him.

—

The name Bass could have been acquired by William. Is there any reason to think his “unknown African father” was a Bass or thst he had Bass siblings?

In other words, what is the basis of this statement in the “about” for William:

This is not the Y-dna of William's half siblings who were the R Haplo group of their father John Bass, Sr. The mother of all the children was Elizabeth (the Nansemond).

Edward Pat Bass - Y DNA conflict - he’s back as DNA Markers: A-M31 details.

In 3 DAYS? This is ridiculous.

Or it’s the other way around, and Keziah was the wife of Capt. John Bass, and “Elizabeth the Nansemond”, mother of William by unknown African man, father of William.

I ask this because of the note in the profile for Richard Bass, Sr.

Richard Bass, son of John Bass and Keziah his wife was borned on ye Second day of August in the year of our Lord 1658. Jane Bryant was borned on ye 17th day of December in the year of our Lord 1665. They were married according to the Canons the 6th day of November Anno dom. 1680. The said Jane Bass departed this life on ye 14 of February in the year of our Lord 1689/90, the mother of Charles Basse, Samuel Basse, James Basse, Matthew Basse, Keziah Basse, and Anna Basse, all Baptized Christian persons. The said Richard Basse took to wife Mary Burwell on ye 25 day of August in the year of our Lord 1695 and begat Andrew Basse, Alexander Basse, Richard Basse, Mary Basse, Uriah Basse, and Thomas Basse, every one a Bpatized Christian.

Is this accurate? From 2015

https://nativeamericanroots.wordpress.com/2015/05/22/the-nansemond-...

The Nansemond branch of the English Bass family begins with the marriage in 1638 of John Bass(e) an English colonist to Elizabeth, baptized daughter of the chief of the Nansemond tribe. Their marriage was recorded in the Bass family sermon book that has survived to the present. Albert Bell’s book contained an incorrect transcription of this marriage record that falsely states Elizabeth’s name was “Keziah Elizabeth Tucker” and that her father was “Robin the elder”. However as you can read from a copy of the original marriage entry, her name is simply “Elizabeth” and her father’s name is not mentioned at all. “Keziah” is however a first name found frequently among descendants of the Nansemond Bass family, so it is possible that this mix-up comes from fractured memories of the family history. So if you are a Bass descendant or researcher, please check your family tree to make sure you have the correct information. Below is an image of the marriage:

—-
John Bass/e and Elizabeth the Nansemond had several children including a son named William Bass (1654-1741) who appears to have the most well documented descendants. William Bass was married to a woman named Catherine Lanier and they made their home in what was then known as Lower Norfolk County, Virginia along the Western Branch of the Elizabeth River. William Bass Sr and Catherine Lanier had the following children:

• Edward Bass b. 19 Oct 1672
• John Bass b. 4 Dec 1673

Keziah Bass b. 30 Oct 1675

• William Bass b. 28 Oct 1676

Joseph Bass b. 21 Dec 1678
Mary Bass b. 15 Jun 1681

• Thomas Bass b. 13 Nov 1687

—-

So this supports the marriage of John (son of Nathaniel) did marry Elizabeth, and they are the parents of every Bass except William.

So William (who married Catherine Lanier) was a stepson? Or - are we sure he’s Elizabeth’s child at all?

Please advise if this blog is best we know so I can lock down based on it.

It can wait until the Bass family communicates more.

https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Basse-5

I think this might be the issue.

I think you are confusing your Williams. William Bass, born about 1755 was a free man of color, so yes, the Y-DNA of his male descendants is not the same as that of the much earlier John and Elizabeth Bass.

posted Oct 24, 2020 by Kathie (Parks) Forbes

—-

I’ll try to track that William down.

The DNA spreadsheet is confused, it shows Capt John (of Nathaniel of England) as A (I presume propagating from the William whose descendant tested A). I don’t think there’s an argument there isn’t A. The problem is when / who, as Y DNA doesn’t have a time frame.

I’ll go ahead and merge duplicate John’s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nansemond

John Bass, a colonist in early 17th-century Virginia, married Elizabeth, the daughter of the leader of the Nansemond Nation. After she was baptized into the established Anglican Church of the colony, they married on August 14, 1638. Bass had been born 7 September 1616; he died in 1699.[8] They had eight children together (Elizabeth, John, Jordan, Keziah, Nathaniel, Richard, Samuel, and William). Although Christianized, Elizabeth likely raised their children in Nansemond culture. The tribe had a matrilineal kinship system in which the children were considered to be born into their mother's clan and people. Some Nansemond claim descent from this marriage.[5] Based on her research, Dr. Helen C. Rountree says that all current Nansemond descend from this marriage.[6]

6. Dr. Helen C. Rountree, "Nansemond History", Nansemond Tribal Association, accessed 16 Sep 2009
8. Sermon Book of John Bass, owned by the Nansemond Tribe.
9. Heinegg, Paul (1995). Free African Americans of Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, Maryland and Delaware: Indian Families Bass & Weaver.

—-

maybe we can find in Heinegg.

https://nativeamericanroots.wordpress.com/2015/05/22/the-nansemond-... conflicts with https://www.genealogy.com/forum/surnames/topics/bass/5241/

—-

Edward Basse, the brother to John Basse, married Mary Tucker, a baptized Chowanoac (Chowan) Indian and, according to the prayer book, went to live with her people. Edward and Mary had three (3) daughters and one (1) son, John (born 1650, Chowan Precinct), that we know of. Their son John, had two (2) sons that we are able to determine, John Jr. (born 1673) and Edward (born abt. 1675). John married Love Harris and they produced eleven (11) children. Due to Incorrect information placed on the Internet, many applicants connect John Bass and Love Harris to William Bass and Catherine Lanier, William being the descendent of John Bass and Elizabeth. William Bass and Catherine were raising a family in Virginia (St. Brides Pa and Old Norfolk, which became Norfolk County later the City of Chesapeake in what is now the Deep Creek area along the Dismal Swamp) long before John and Love Harris married in North Carolina. The Indian lineage of Edward’s descendents comes through his wife, Mary Tucker, the Chowan Indian and not through John and Elizabeth. Documents show William and Catherine in Norfolk County with children when John and Love Harris were getting married ….

—-
I cannot find parents for
Jordan Oren Bass, Sr On either of those sources.

https://www.familytreedna.com/groups/bass/about/background

As often happens in family studies, we have had more than a few "aha" moments. None has been more surprising than the Haplogroup A results of men who descend from men who culturally and socially appeared to be the descendants of William 1654-1741 (John, Nathaniel, Humphrey). This is an amazing result to say the least. A is the oldest and rarest haplogroup.