Mordechai Shmuel Stern - Confsion between Shmuel son of Itzik from Stimtura and Mordechai Shmuel from Leordina

Started by Yaakov Moshe Schatz on Tuesday, August 10, 2021
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8/10/2021 at 6:38 PM

It seems we have here a confusion between Shmuel the son of Itzhak Stern who lived in Szurdok (Strimtura) and according to Agadot Stimura left his house to his son Yaakov, and Mordechai Shmuel Stern who lived and had several children in leordina.

I suggest we first discuss whether these were two people or one and then we determine for each child who his parent was. If each person could present the evidence for each child how they know who his father was that would be helpful.

Thanks in advance.

Private User
8/10/2021 at 7:11 PM

His name is Shmiel not mordechai

8/10/2021 at 7:22 PM

The two are absolutely not the same people. I don't know whose son Mordechai Shmuel of Leordina was, but his three daughters, were ALL my mother's great grandmothers. Aidel Stern was married to Shmuel Fried of Ruscova (grandparents of my grandfather, Mordechai Fried), Elka Stern was married to Eliezer Tessler of Viseu de Sus (also grandparents of my grandfather, Mordechai Fried,) and Frayda was married to Efriam Fishel Stern of Stramtura.(grandparents of my grandmother, Yitta Ruchel Fried). Efraim Fishel Stern was the son of the a/m Yaakov Stern of Stramtura . It was know in the family the Efaim Fishel Stern and his wife Frayda were cousins, but nobody knew exactly how.
Mordechai Shmuel also had a very famous son Yitzchock Stern of Bistana who was the son-in-law of Shaul Yehuda Steinmetz of Dibova.
My mother A"H told me that Mordechai Shmuel Stern was also either a grandson or a great-grandson of Rav Itzchak Stern of Stramtura but as much as I researched I could not find how. Maybe someone out there would know.
I'd very much appreciate it if you can keep me up-to-date regarding this. Thank you.

8/10/2021 at 7:29 PM

Thanks for the quick responses. I will make a new profile for Mordechai Shmuel of Leordina and his wife and move the daughters you mentioned to the right place. I will also remove Mordechai from this profile.

8/10/2021 at 8:03 PM

I left @Menachem Mendel Stern as a son of Shmuel Stern from szurdok, as Mordechai Shmuel alrready has a son Mendel israel. I moved @Raizel Stern to Mordechai Shmuel Stern, becuase the profile was added by a tesler. Would you know who this Reisel is?

Mordechai Shuel has a son born 1848 (Istzhak from Bistana), so he was probably born before 1830. As such, he was probably a grandson of Rav Itzchak Stern of Stramtura. He would not be a son of Shmuel and Binyamin Aba died before having children, so there are five condidtaes left. Hopefully we will figure this out.

8/10/2021 at 8:27 PM

Raizel was also a daughter of Mordechai Shmuel Stern of Leordina. She was the first wife of Efraim Fishel Stern of Stramtura. We think he had some children with her and when she passed away he married her sister Frayda with whom he had additional children including my grandmother's mother, Chaya.

Private User
8/11/2021 at 4:24 AM

R' Mordechai Shmiel Stern was definitely a son or a son of a son of R' Yitzchok of Stremtura. I would not yet jump to conclusion that Shmiel and Mordechai Shmiel are not the same people.

Private User
8/12/2021 at 8:39 AM

check out this link for some clarity

https://www.geni.com/documents/view/361260158810010127?doc_id=60000...

this was written by my great grandfather Mojsa Smil Shmuel Stern he was niftar in the war

Private User
8/12/2021 at 9:46 AM

where do you see about R' Mordechai Shmiel father of R' Yitzchok Stern of Bysztina?

Private User
8/13/2021 at 3:23 AM

Exactly you don't, so it's a different person

8/13/2021 at 10:41 AM

About 25 years ago my son was in bistana with his rosh yesiva rav smelka leifer. At my mother's behest he searced for the matzevah of rav yizchok stern,who was her great uncle. My son found it and we have a picure of it. It says:
Yitzchok ben
mMordechai shmuel

8/15/2021 at 2:50 PM

Chaya Klein, Could you upload the picture to his profile:

Yitzchak Stern

Thanks.

8/15/2021 at 2:52 PM

Esther, could you write a little about what you were told about the family? There are a lot of documents out there but it is hard to put all the details together to get a clear picture. The oral stories coming down the generations are sometimes the best complimentary source.

Private User
8/24/2021 at 7:13 PM

That My grandfather Reb Yitzchok Stern of Bishtina was named after his paternal grandfather Reb Yotzchok of Strumtrera and that it was well known that he inhereted his grandfathers traits in having been a great Machnis Oirech and having had a house a Beis Vaad Lechachomim, as it clearly says on his Matzeveh which still stands in Byshtina

8/26/2021 at 12:58 AM

Thanks. These testimonies are so important in constructing the tree. Would you be able to upload a picture of the Matzevah?

8/27/2021 at 2:25 PM

I will upload the picture of the Matzevah of Yitzchok Stern of Bistana as soon as possible. I am waiting for my son to help me with the upload.

Another note to Rav Yitzchok Stern of Bistana-He was a very rich man and he had a magnificent home and garden in Bistana. When Rav Leifer of Nadvornah came to Bistana to become its Rav, then Rav Yitzchock Stern vacated his home and gave it to the ,Rebbe of Nadvornah.

He was married to Zlata, the youngest daughter of Shaul Yehuda (Leib) Steinmetz of Dibova

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