Johanna Susanna Ferreira - Your valued opinions on this request, is needed please. Appreciate!

I have looked around a bit, but have not yet find any docs on her.

I added these parents only on my My Heritage profile (now removed) but that could have been in the days when I was naive enough to believe info I found on MyHeritage was always correct.
I make a point of never adding to Geni unless I have a document.
Cannot find any documents regarding her.

The name Johanna does exist in Norway, so that name along with Susanna could be correct..As stated earlier Conversos did go to Norway, so this could be an accurate profile..Pity there is no female descendancy, otherwise mtdna could've been useful.

A family name relating to someone who worked with iron. A smith, blacksmith etc. In latin languages it could be Farrar, Ferrara and Ferrari, Herrers, Farreres, and Ferreira.

I don't get any sephardic vibes from the name Ferreira. It just sounds portuguese.

Johanna and Susanna sounds swedish. In danish or norwegian the natural nameforms would be JohannE SusannE.

Johanna and Susanna does not sound sephardic at all.

Reading from Wiki:
While Norway was part of the Danish kingdom from 1536 to 1814, Denmark introduced a number of religious restrictions both to uphold the Protestant Reformation in general and against Jews in particular. In 1569, Fredrik II ordered that all foreigners in Denmark had to affirm their commitment to 25 articles of faith central to Lutheranism, on pain of deportation, forfeiture of all property, and death.

The earliest recorded direct mention of Jews occurred in documents published in the 17th century when a group of Portuguese Jews were allowed to settle in Norway. Restrictions were lifted for Sephardic Jews already established as merchants in Altona when Christian IV took over the town. Christian also issued the first letter of safe passage to a Jew (Albert Dionis) in 1619, and on June 19, 1630, general amnesty was granted to all Jews permanently in residence in Glückstadt, including the right to travel freely throughout the kingdom.[9]

In this condition, the existence of anti-Semitism can be considered negligible because the traditional Jewish prejudice often stemmed from the perception that the Jews controlled the economic, political and social spheres of a specific European society.[10]

In 1687, Christian V rescinded all Jewish privileges, specifically banning Jews from Norway, except with a special dispensation. Jews found in the kingdom were jailed and expelled, and this ban persisted until 1851. / wiki

This sentence sticks out::
" The earliest recorded direct mention of Jews occurred in documents published in the 17th century when a group of Portuguese Jews were allowed to settle in Norway"

I have never heard of it, but it might be worth looking into.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Norway

King Christian IV, king of both Denmark and Norway (ruled 1588-1648), believed that Jews could help his country, but he faced opposition from his clergy, which limited Jewish access. In spite of this, from 1620 Jews were allowed to settle in the Danish duchies of Schleswig and Holstein (lost to Germany in 1848-9). Christian IV then granted freedom of religion throughout both Denmark and Norway, and in 1630 granted permission for Jews to travel and trade throughout his kingdom. Jews were not, as in many other countries, forced to live in ghettos or in special Jewish streets or to wear clothes that would distinguish them. In 1641, the king extended this “protection” to include Ashkenazi Jews.

Under King Christian IV’s successor, King Fredrik III (ruled 1648-70), Jews lived under stricter conditions. They were not allowed to be in the Danish-Norwegian kingdom without a letter of safe conduct; the policy was later enshrined in the Norwegian Legal Code promulgated by King Christian V (ruled 1670-99) in 1687. https://jewish-heritage-europe.eu/norway/

It was only in the time of king Christian IV (late 16th century) that we find references to the Jews. The Jews in question were mainly those who in 1492 and 1498 were driven out of Spain and Portugal.

These Sephardi Jews first settled in the Netherlands and in Hamburg. In Norway, these were called “Portuguese-Jews.” Some of them were given special permission to enter Norway when no other Jews could. https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/norway-virtual-jewish-history-...

According to Graetz, Portuguese Jews in Amsterdam were invited in 1622 by King Christian

https://www.jstor.org/stable/4466405

Cited therein as "Portuguese Jews," the term referred to Sephardim from Spain as well as from Portugal who had been expelled from their home countries in 1492 and 1497, respectively.

In the early 1600s, under the rule of King Christian IV, Jews were granted freedom of religion plus permission to settle in certain areas of the then-joint state of Denmark-Norway. Soon after, they were allowed to travel and to conduct trade. Jews were hardly integrated within society during this time, but they were not forced to live in Jewish-only areas or to wear any physical markers that would announce their faith. The situation for Jews became precarious during the reign of King Fredrik III, however. / https://www.milkandhoneytours.com/jewish-tours/oslo/

An example of a Teixeira doing copper business in Norway
"Usually he [Manuel Teixeira] left his business proceedings in Denmark to agents like, e.g., Antoni Enriques or to his sons Diego Abraham Teixeira de Mattos and Samuel Teixeira, who often stayed in Copenhagen. The latter was mainly in charge of the Norwegian copper trade — a trade which was initiated in cooperation with Henrik Müller, the owner of the copper mines in Kvikne."
http://utne.nvg.org/j/njhist.html

https://www.proquest.com/openview/6a7d66a26d9f6e73d834eb7d8503abd7/...
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So it would not be improbable that a person having a portuguese family name left Norway at that time. Probably that persons family had been living in Hamburg/Antwerpen/ the Netherlands

Here is a Salomon Ferreira https://genes.tronsmit.com/tree/Theron/individual/I6757/Salomon-Fer...

Phillipp I am just reading and sharing my findings. A hypothetical or probable chain of events. To understand what could have happened before starting a wild goose chase.

However:
Why JohannA SusannA?
Ferreira would indicate portuguese roots.

If some sephardic persons arrived to Norway on invitation of Christian IV they would be contributing with skills and/or capital. There should or could be a trace of that, Like in the case of Teixera (also a portuguese name).

What did the South African family work with? Where did they arrive?

For me it seemed very impobable at first. Why on earth should someone named Ferreira arrive from Norway at that time?

I am reading on the profile:

Robbert Robbertszen Brand, SV/PROG

through=6000000037537001493
Robbert Robbertszen Brand, SV/PROG MP
Birth:cirka 1680
Oslo, Norway (Norge)
Death before 20 mars 1721 Cape, South Africa
quartermaster in the employ of the Dutch East India Company (1699)

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If he is RobbertZEN , then his father should be a Robbert?

So the parents and the son were born in Norway?
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(He shows up connected to me by Visser and Smit)

Christian IV invited ALL sorts of skilled people to boost the economy. Germans, dutch, swedes, french, huguenots - as long as they worked and contributed.

After his death the liberalism was shut down. Economically as well as religiously.

There are records of Ferreiras in Norway, during the 19th century..Obviously the descendants of those earlier immigrants/refugees.

Just thinking: If Johanna Susanna Ferreira's say grandparents, went to Norway, perhaps their son decided to name his daughter Johanna, which is after all a Biblical name to fit in with living in Norway..Susanna is likewise a biblical name, but in Hebrew would've been Shushanna.

I have the following questionmarks:

Shouldn’t Robbertzen have a Robbert as a farher?

Why is JohannA SusannA spelled the swedish way?

Her husband has family name Marx Brand had he been found?

Found othe Ferreiras but not by way of Norway https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Ferreira-112

No sources for her or her husband.
Added as parents here by Jan Blomerus , I wonder from what source .

1 May 2020 parents changed to JS Ferreira and Engelbertus Marx Brand by Jan Blomerus .
No source for that that I can see or find.

Note if she and her husband had died in SA they should be SM/Prog and SV/Prog not their son.

Time to remove these unsourced parents.

Sharon Doubell

Private

Wilma you collaborate with Jan Blomerus maybe best you ask him why he added them as parents here May 2020

@ J P Weyers

The persons are unsourced.

There are a lot of questionable circumstances around the naming and facts given in the profiles.

The discussion around the origins of the Ferreira seems not to lead further..

In my opinion the profiles should be removed unless sources are provided.

Think Wilfred Duckett removed them.