John Joseph Vann - Background research

Note:; John Vann is first mentioned in 1751. He was sent on an important mission of organizing supplies for the Choctaw Indians, at the direction of the South Carolina Governor Glen. Therefore, John Vann was a contemporary of Edward Vann (his brother); in the 1750's, both men were buying land near each other in the Ninety-Six District of South Carolina. In 1751, deer skins were stolen from a group of Cherokee hunters by white men; some of the skins were discovered at John Vann's trading post. Later that year renegade Indians looted the store of Bernard Hughes and wounded another white trader. In the resulting panic, Hughes, James Adair, and others fled to the sanctuary of John Vann's store. Vann's unnamed wife (Waw-li Vann's) mother told them that he was away at the fort at Ninety-Six.

Later in 1760, there was a major uprising of Creek and Cherokees against the South Carolina frontier, in which John Vann was able to raise the alarm of the impending attack to the local militia. In 1770 Alexander Cameron, deputy royal agent to the Cherokee's, wrote to his boss, John Stewart, that John Vann had been hired as a new (Linquist, i.e. Interpreter) to replace the recently deceased John Watts, Sr. This was despite a reputation as John Vann as a drunkard. Note that Cameron, Stewart, Watts, and most certainly John Vann, had Cherokee offspring. John Watt's Jr., a.k.a. Young Tassel became the war chief of the Chickamauga; he was the uncle of the famous Cherokee linguistic genius, Sequoyah. In 1777 another Interpreter, Joseph Vann was the notorious Sycamore Shoals land sale by the Cherokees known as the Henderson Purchase; another attendee was the famous Daniel Boone. During the Revolutionary War in 1779 there were a number of white men residing among the Chickamauga Band of Cherokees, who were reported by Indian trader Robert Due to Alexander Cameron to have joined war parties about to attack the American frontier.

One was John Vann (perhaps a vigorous 58-year-old) and another was Joseph Vann (his nephew and son-in-law?). Or this Joseph Vann may have been the second Interpreter. Others mentioned in Due's letter were Nathan Hicks, John McDonald, Walter Scott and Anthony Foreman. Among the Cherokees mentioned were the Raven of Chota, the Great Warrior Oconostota and Ocanostota's son, The Terrapin, all of whom were relatives of James Vann. The test of this document can be found posted in the "Jim Hicks Cherokee Page" website.

Joseph VANN was with Dragging Canoe and his Chickamauga Warriors at Knoxville and were defeated, having to move their tribes lower into Indian Territory at what is now CHICKAMAUGA. JOSEPH VANN was of this tribe. (John Joseph VANN is about 48 years old in 1779 - estimations). Sept. 27 1793 - Daniel SMITH Letter to Henry KNOX. Again the Indian command system lost the Chickamauga their last chance to carry their colors to the Clinch River. The command of the Army was shared by Doublehead and Watts. Doublehead was one who dallied along the way to plunder every frontier cabin although a surprise move against Knoxville was the object. Then Doublehead and JOSEPH VANN, also Chickamauga commander lost valuable hours in the early morning in a dispute over whether to take prisoners. (AMERICAN STATES PAPERS - INDIAN AFFAIRS).

James Vann House Present Day Chief James Vann House
Chief James Vann Posted 02 Jun 2013 by mjboyd122 Cherokee Chief James Vann built his house in 1805. James Vann was the son of the trader John Joseph Vann and the Cherokee Waw-Li. James was a town chief. He owned a tavern and operated a tavern using 99 black slaves. James was shot to death at Buffington's Tavern by an enemy. Reportedly, his grave is marked with a headstone, inscribed:

"Here lies James Vann He killed many a white man At Last by a rifle ball he fell And devils dragged him off to hell."

James Clement Vann, usually identified as James VANN, or "Chief" is said to have been born in the 21st year of his father. His mother was Wah Li, the Cherokee girl. Chief James VANN is known to have married Jenny FOSTER, Elizabeth THORNTON, and Margaret SCOTT, and is know to have had children by each wife. But polygamy was accepted by the Cherokee at that date, and it is generally accepted that James had other wives not known to us present-day historians. When James VANN's will was nullified by the Cherokee Council on April 17, 1909, it was decreed that "all the children (who) are of one father ought to receive some share of the property." Then several children are named, who are not known by historians to have been children of his known wives, listed earlier. James VANN sometimes kept two wives under his roof at the same time. His son Joe VANN, is said to have done the same thing, and admonished the two wives that there was no favoritism between them while under one roof! James VANN was surely a complex man, with a strange combination of skills and characteristics. He was influential on the frontier and was a good businessman. He was loved by a few, respected by many more, and feared by many. In Governor John SERVIER's Journal of 1798 appeared the following: "James VANN, a half-breed lives near town (Estanislau) who from his wealth & extensiveness of his trade, together with his ability, has become a leading character, and is daily growing in consequence & importance in his nation. I repeat that he is a man of consequence & rising importance." Chief James VANN, controlled much Cherokee land, farming many acres near present-day Spring Place, called Diamond Hill. He bought & sold slaves, both Black and Red. There were iron-barred cages in the basement where prisoners or troublesome slaves were held, according to those who lived there at that time. The cages were evidently removed when the house was rebuilt. James had a Tavern at New Echota, about 12 miles south of Spring Place, and a still at Spring Place, where at various times there was a mill for grinding grain, a kiln for baking brick, and a church & school, which had been built and conducted by the Moravian Missionaries. James VANN had persuaded the Moravians to come to Spring Place, making land available to them for this purpose. In 1802 one of the Moravians wrote in his diary, "Mr. VANN is planning a still by the spring near the Mission House, and a home for himself on the exact hill where Brother STEINER had thought to build." The only known sister of Chief James VANN was Nancy VANN, who married John FAWLING (Falling), spelled variously. For reasons unknown, James VANN and his brother-in-law John FAWLING became enemies, and they agreed to "shoot-it-out" in a duel. According to the terms of the duel, each man would mount a horse, at opposite ends of a local road, and ride toward each other with drawn pistols, and shooting at will. John FAWLING was killed in this fight, but the Cherokee Council, for reasons not known, considering that the duel was unfair, and decreed that the killing was murder and that James VANN should pay with his life. According to Cherokee custom, when execution was pronounced, the Cherokee Council appointed an executioner whose identity was known only to them. But according to custom, the executioner was usually a kinsman of the victim of the "crime" that had been committed. According to Moravian records, however, the man appointed to kill James VANN was Mr. Alex SAUNDERS, whose kin, if any to John FAWLING is not known. The Moravian records state: "On the 19th of Feb. Our neighbor, Mr. James VANN, was shot in Thomas BUFFINGTON's house about 56 miles from here. It is not known definitely who shot him, but everyone thinks it was Mr. Alex SAUNDERS formerly Mr. VANN's best friend, who had become his enemy. Mr. VANN had said many harsh things about him and had abused him that very evening. So the end has come to this man, far-famed, little beloved, and greatly feared by the entire Cherokee Nation. His end was sudden, for no sign of life showed after he was shot. With a company of so-called Light Horse Regiment, he was riding the length & breadth of the Cherokee land, arresting & punishing thieves. Many were severely whipped, one was beaten almost to death. One who resisted arrest was Shot. We owe very special thanks to God our Savior that from the first this man was favorable to us. It is a sign that He is Lord of All, and holds in his hand even the wildest men. About us everything is in the utmost confusion. All minds are shocked by this death and filled with fear of the things which may follow. Some of the Negroes are excited, others gone wild. Mr. Zaphariah COODY, who come recently as overseer does not know whether he can continue his work or whether it would be better for him to go to Natchez. He is a cousin of Mr. VANN, and has 3 nice children who attend our school. Oh, how we have wished that the love and friendship which Mr. VANN has shown us may have gained for him a place in the houses of peace. We pray the Savior to remember the promise He gave in Mathew 10-42. ( "And who so ever shall give to drink unto one of these little ones a cup of cold water only in the name of a disciple, verily I say unto you, he shall in no wise lose his reward.") We have called on Mrs. VANN, and have given her what comfort we could. As you may imagine she is in the deepest trouble; and she could not speak for weeping. We commend her and ourselves and our Brown children to the prayers of our brethren." On Aug. 13, 1810, Margaret Scott VANN, James VANNs widow, was baptized Margaret Ann SCOTT by the Moravians at Spring Place, Georgia. She no longer used her husbands' name, as was the custom among the Cherokees after a husband's death. James VANN was buried in the old Blackburn Family Cemetery on the Etowah River between Ball Ground & Cummings. This spot is about 42 miles SE of Spring Place. His son, Rich Joe VANN's second wife, was named Polly BLACKBURN and this cemetery might be her family's burial ground. But there is a postlude to James VANNs death and burial. His body was not to "Rest in Peace!" For in 1962 the body of James VANN was exhumed from the Blackburn Cemetery, brought to Dalton Georgia, and placed in a funeral home there. According to Lloyd GULLEDGE of the Atlanta Journal, the exhumation was done by Archeologist Wayne YEAGER at the direction of J. Raymond VANN of Mt. Veron, New York in 1962, after securing a permit from Forsyth County Ordinary, A.B. TOLLISON who acted as a witness to the exhumation. The stated purpose of the removal of the body of James VANN was to eventually have it re-interred near his old home at Spring Place according to his descendant, Mr. J. Raymond VANN. Mrs. BANDY (Dickie Bradley Bandy), Mr. ZBAR, and John WEAR were other who witnessed the removal. According to Mr. YEAGER the upper right arm bone of James VANN showed evidence that it had been fractured, as by a bullet wound, which James VANN is said (By some account) to have suffered in the "duel." There have been suggestions that James VANN had been mildly crippled for some time prior to his death. which causes one to wonder if the broken bone discovered in the exhumation had not occurred from an earlier accident. As of 1984 there is no knowledge that James VANN body has yet been reburied at Spring Place, and is presumed to still be in a Dalton Funeral Home.

THE VANN HOUSE AT SPRING PLACE, GEORGIA From Moravian Mission Letters of 1802 is the following: MR. VANN (James ) is planning a still by the spring near the Mission house, and a home for himself on the exact hill where brother STEINER had thought to build. The site selected stands on an elevation overlooking the Cohutta Mountains at the village of Spring Place in Murry County, three miles west of Chatsworth the County Seat, and U.S. rout 411. (Georgia Dept. Of Commerce, letter 1955.) The Moravian Missionaries who in 1801 were living at Tellico, about 30 miles NE across the Tennessee state line from Spring Place, Georgia, was invited to Come to Spring place by James VANN, who had jurisdiction over the area, to build their Mission School and Church. At that time there were only two cabins, and these belonged to BROWM, a Cherokee, who was about to move away from Spring Place. A builder named VOGT, who had agreed to build for VANN, appeared in July 1803, and began to make preparations for its construction. Preparations likely consisted of cutting timber for the lumber, and baking bricks in a kiln built for that purpose. Moravian letters of Jan 14, 1803 state that, Brother BAYHAN and Mr. SCHNEIDER are helping today with Mr. VANNs new house, which is being erected. By Aug. 13 (1804 ?) reference in Moravian letters indicate that the VANNs house was completed. The finished house consisted of two main floors, a basement, and an attic. On each of the two main floors are two-room 30 by 20 feet, with a wide hallway between. On the third floor, or attic, are two long rooms. The basement, or dungeon as some have described it, had a covered entrance. Moravian Mission letters note, VANN moved into his newly built house today. Date March 24, 1805.) Before restoration was begun about 1955 there still remained iron-barred cages in the basement, reminders of unhappy prisoners and slaves who were held there from time to time. Among the many who were instrumental in the restoration of the VANN House was Dickie Bradley BANDY, president of the Whitefield-Murray Historical Society. In 1948 added impetus was given restoration plans when Will ROGERS Jr. contacted Mrs. BANDY, and lent the ROGERS name to the enterprise which, Did much to create and stimulate interest in saving this Historic old Indian home... It is said the cost to James VANN to build his home at Spring Place was ten thousand dollars. Negotiations prior to the rebuilding were made by interested citizens with Dr. J.E. BRADFORD, owner of the property, and obtained an option on the house and three acres for five thousand dollars. When the money was eventually raised, through the efforts of many, The VANN House was deeded to the State of Georgia. Since it has become a Georgia State Museum, the State has spent approximately fifty-thousand dollars on its restoration, under the supervision of Dr. H. Chanlee FORMAN. From comments of Clemens De Baillou: One thing we must admit, and that is that the VANN House was the first ..... solid architectural creation in the manner of an evolved architecture, to appear in the Indian Country, where heretofore had existed only log buildings. It was, in comparison with its surroundings more than a Palais de Versailles in France. James Clement VANN lived in the VANN House at Spring Place from 1804, the date of completion, to 1808 the year of this death. One of the most elaborate establishments was that of Chief Joseph VANN, a mixed-blood living near Spring Place. here he occupied a 2 story brick house, which reportedly cost $10,000. and was designed by an architect from Philadelphia. It dominated a number of outbuildings, slave quarters, and mills on a large plantation with 800 acres in cultivation. (William H. Vann of Fort Worth, Texas: VANN GENERATIONS WITH CHEROKEE ORINHS SC, GA & TN.)

Chief James Vann's House Posted 02 Jun 2013 by mjboyd122 The photograph of the Chief Vann House was built between 1804 and 1806 by the Cherokee leader James Vann. It is called the "Showplace of the Cherokee Nation." The two-story structure features a tall porch and chimneys rising from both ends of the house. Several trees grow in the yard.

The Chief Vann House is located at the intersection of U.S. Highway 76 and Georgia 225 in Murray County on the outskirts of Chatsworth in northwest Georgia. The home was located north of the Moravian Mission at Spring Place. Invited by Vann and other Cherokee leaders, the Moravians provided a school for Cherokee children and housed 114 students between 1804 and 1833.

Male John Joseph Vann 1735 – 6 May 1815 • L2JG-VM7​​

John Joseph Vann 1735–1815 • L2JG-VM7​​

Name • 2 Sources • John Joseph Vann 1735 Edgefield, Edgefield, South Carolina, United States Death 6 May 1815 Spring Place, Murray, Georgia, United States Probate 1753 Chowan, North Carolina, United States Military Service • 8 April 1782 Edenton, Chowan, North Carolina, United States

Family Members Spouses and Children

Show All Spouses and Children John Joseph Vann 1735–1815 • L2JG-VM7​​ Marriage: 1765 Cherokee, Alabama, United States

Polly Gann 1746–1835 • L2JG-V9R​​

Add Parent to John Joseph Vann Unknown Vann Deceased • LTJD-Q1V​​

Children of Unknown Vann (6) Ann Vann 1713–Deceased • LRY2-X21​​

Sarah Vann 1716–Deceased • LRY2-N83​​

John Joseph Vann 1735–1815 • L2JG-VM7​​

Dempsey Vann 1738–1790 • LRY2-LBC​​

Mary Vann 1739–Deceased • KC9W-FNJ​​

Henry I Vann 1744–1801 • 9V4T-YX9​​

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1800 United States Federal Census
Year: 1800; Census Place: Edgefield, South Carolina; Series: M32; Roll: 47; Page: 134; Image: 258; Family History Library Film: 181422 1,7590::483013
1800 United States Federal Census Year: 1800; Census Place: Edgefield, South Carolina; Series: M32; Roll: 47; Page: 134; Image: 258; Family History Library Film: 181422 1,7590::483013
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1830 United States Federal Census
1830; Census Place: Montgomery, Alabama; Series: M19; Roll: 2; Page: 202; Family History Library Film: 0002329 1810 United States Federal Census
Year: 1810; Census Place: Edgefield, South Carolina; Roll: 62; Page: 109; Image: 00089; Family History Library 1790 United States Federal Census
Year: 1790; Census Place: Edgecombe, North Carolina; Series: M637; Roll: 7; Page: 383; Image: 227; Family History Library Film: 0568147 1,5058::168163
1810 United States Federal Census
Year: 1810; Census Place: Abbeville, Abbeville, South Carolina; Roll: 60; Page: 112; Image: 00063; Family History Library Film: 0181419
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North Carolina, Deaths, 1906-1930 Ancestry.com
North Carolina Death Certificates, 1909-1975 Ancestry.com