John ap Gruffudd (Pengruffwnd) - Wales in April 2020

Shortest blood relationship
Gruffydd ap Llewelyn, King of Wales is your 26th great grandfather.

I've been researching my ancestry since December 2018. I was adopted at birth and finally discovered cousins via ancestry.com. I am thrilled with what I'm finding. I had not followed Mary Langford's branch of the tree. I started by researching the paternal line of my birth father and got back to John Griffin, the founding father of Simsbury, Coonecticut, then continued on back thru many of the ancestors you have listed. I was thrilled, honored, and proud to discover that I came from a line of kings, knights, crusaders, saints, etc. After researching my paternal line, I went back and started looking at some of my maternal lines. Imagine my amazement when I discovered that Gwilym Fychan ap Gwilym was married to Ales Dalton, the daughter of Sir Richard Dalton; who was married to Alice de Clifford, 14th great granddaughter of William Longsword; who was the son of Rollo the Viking, and 2nd great grandfather of William the Conqueror. I LOVE my ancestry! Our ancestry!

The Griffiths lineage to the King of England, this lineage is the only true lineage from the King, every other lineage is illegitimate, only the Gruffudd lineage is the true claimants to the throne of England. I am the mix of the bloodlines X2, I am related to everyone that is connected to the system, I am one of a kind, When the mix of the Webb Lineage to Price, mixed with the Hoyts to Price Lineage, and the Freemasonic rule side of the lineage, goes to royalty side, Van Horn, Presidents side, Griffiths side, that's the freemason side, then my Grandfather and Grandmother, were a fixed marriage, so then the mixed lineage, mixed with the mixed lineage, married the mix, so that makes me the mix of all the inherited hierarchy of a family, everyone from the wealthy, too presidents, too people in the movies to Mohammad Ali, and all royalty, I am related to all the rulers and all the kings and Queens of the Royal Tree, mom and dad, like I am the connected one to know if you are apart of the system, like a Santa Clause, connected to all that were inventors and people in large corporations, etc, etc. I am the mix of the Kings and Queens of the Globe, from the Huns to Afghani kings and pharaohs to Egypt thru Mediterranean sea and the basin I am the king of Kings, Spanish to the French, Goths to the Vikings, King of them all, nobody has the connection like I do, the world is my oyster, my family my mom and dad, I should be the grandfather of this world to make this world a better place by making it right, for the children of the future. let there future be in peace.

👀

Hello Everyone,

I hate to be a downer but the Griffith lineage mentioned above seem to break at the immigrant ancestor Edward Griffin of Flushing of Flushing, NY.

See Theresa Griffin's extensively researched and sourced discussion of the origins of Edward Griffin and the myths which have been associated with the Griffin family. Edward Griffin, son of John ap Gruffudd Griffithes and Ann Langford died by 1622 in England.

The same goes for Sgt. John Griffin of Simsbury of Simsbury, CT. Theresa Griffin writes that DNA evidence has ruled out that the two of them were brothers and that the John Griffin who was the son of John ap Gruffudd Griffithes and Ann Langford died by 1624 in England.

Theresa Griffin writes that "we have unequivocal evidence that this Pengriffin family cannot possibly be the ancestors of our Edward Griffin of Flushing or of Sgt. John Griffin of Simsbury. The men in question had been dead for more than ten years before the Abraham or the Constance departed London in October of 1635."

She also writes that the coat of arms that are associated with the Griffin families in the U.S. belong to completely different families. "The coat of arms attributed to the descendants of Edward Griffin, Sgt. John Griffin, and Jasper Griffing, was actually awarded to Griffin Appenreth, of Calais, who died in 1553, leaving no male heirs. No American or Canadian Griffins have rights to the following coat-of-arms, family crest, or motto"

Sincerely,
Tamas Caldwell-Gilbert

The link for Theresa Griffin's research is here: http://freepages.rootsweb.com/~theresagriffin/genealogy/debunkingwe...

Tamás Flinn Caldwell-Gilbert thank you.

I’ve disconnected Edward Griffin of Flushing Jasper Griffing, of Southold & Sgt. John Griffin of Simsbury as children of John ap Gruffudd Griffithes - and as brothers to each other, which they were not.

I have all the evidence to support my claim that you are wrong, I knew you guys would do that, sad that you have to cover up the past and delete the lineage to make it no a possible match, you guys are bad, but I have all the evidence, lol I knew you would do it, Erica Howton really, sad they have to do that, but sorry I have all the evidence I need, this will go down in history people, how the system works for the people, well, tables are turned, sad you have to delete history, people will find out, we already know

If you have all the evidence and sources that are correct. Put them here and give them a look

@John Stephen Saponaro Hi cousin! 13th once removed. Welcome, welcome. We have a whole bunch of cousins here. I envy you the trip to Wales. I've traced my line back to Wales only recently. My mom had always said I had a fingernail sliver of Welsh but I was too little to wonder from where that Welsh came. I just did a quick search
https://www.historic-uk.com/HistoryUK/HistoryofWales/Kings-Princes-...

and found Rhodri the Great, king of the Britons is my 29th great grandfather.

Rhodri the Great, king of the Britons

He might be yours, too.
You are so lucky to have run so far down your lines. I've been doing this off and on since I was a teenager, seriously since I've been here, and still have brick walls. Good for you. :)

Hey, Mr, you are so good to have one person decide whether or not you are doing the right thing, but I would suggest that ya think before you act, cause we are not the smartest around and so confident that you are the solution, but you can't get ahead of yourself and assume that what is already on the lineage is true, knowledge it was put there for a reason, that the knowledge is true, to try to stop the lineage for people to have piece of mind and you look for outs to forbid them there right to there own family to change what is true to invalid lineage for what you not beyond a reasonable doubt to believe that the information that you preceding is true, not looking for Theresa Griffin's research, you are on what page?? Just go and disconnect the lineage without consulting the truth to life itself to stop us from connecting to the past, what was on there connect it back up please of we are dealing with my family lineage, which you are not in between the line there, you have no authority to judge what is right or wrong here, please if you have anything to do with this lineage I am the only autority for any modifications to this line, stop. Edward Griffin
FamilySearch Family Tree
Birth: 1602 - Walton, Radnorshire, Wales, United Kingdom
Death: From 1698 - Flushing, Queens, New York, British Colonial America
Parents: John Pengruffwind Griffin, Anne Griffin (born Langford)
Wife: Mary Griffin (born David)
Children: Edward Griffin, Edward Griffin Jr., Jasper Griffin, Jasper Griffin, John Griffin, John Griffin, Samuel Griffin, and names of 2 more children
Siblings: Sgt. John Griffin, Ann Cowper (born Griffin), Katrin Griffin, Margaret Griffin, Joan Griffin

Edward is born 1602, not 1622

https://www.familysearch.org/tree/find/name?search=1&gender=mal...

https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/LYSL-NHD

Edward Griffin, son of Johan Pengruffwnd and Ann Langfort, was born in Walton, Pembrokeshire, South Wales, about 1602. He enlisted in the King's service, was convicted of justifiable manslaughter and pardoned by the King 7 Jan. 1625. In 1633 he was financial agent for Lady Wake. He left London for Virginia 24 Oct. 1635, aged 33, with his brother John in the the ship Constant. He entered the service of Capt. William Claybourne and was captured on Palmer's Island in 1638 by soldiers of Lord Baltimore. He escaped and came to New Amsterdam in 1640. He is said to have settled in Flushing in 1653, but would seem to have been living in Gravesend in 1656. He was one of the signers of the the Flushing remonstrance against Governor Stuyvesant's order forbidding the harboring of Quakers, 27 Dec. 1657. In 1661 he was a resident of Oyster Bay, and on Sept. 23rd of that year he acted as interpreter between the Indians and John Richbell in the purchase of land in Mamaroneck. Some time before 1675 he settled permanently in Flushing. He sailed for England on 14 Dec. 1678 in the ship Blossom, but later returned to Flushing. In 1686 he petitioned in behalf of his son John in relation to his share of the common lands of Flushing. The census of 1698 records him as still living in Flushing with wife Mary and daughter Deborah. He had sons: Edward, John and Richard. --from Families of the colonial town of Philipsburgh by Grenville Mackenzie

https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=coo.31924055329670;view=1up;...

Arrived from London in 1635 on the Abrham. Landed on Palmers Island near the Susquehanna River for three years. Captured by emissarys of Lord Baltimore detained in Maryland and escaped to the Dutch Colony of New Amsterdam.

He was in the service of Captain Clayborne, who fought Lord Baltimore in 1638. He was captured by Lord Baltimore's soldiers, but escaped from Maryland and came to New Amsterdam in 1640, where he was set free. He moved to Flushing, NY where he lived and died.

Edward Griffin had been in the service of King James I (Stuart) and was convicted of justifiable manslaughter, but granted pardon by the King on 7 January 1625

Emigrated to Maryland in 1635 aboard the "Abraham"

https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/LJGM-31H, Ann Langford MP
Gender: Female
Birth: circa 1555
Walton,,Pembrokeshire,Wales
Death: July 21, 1655 (95-104)
Walton, Swales, Pembrokeshire, Wales

John ap Gruffudd (Pengruffwnd)
Gender: Male
Birth: circa 1560
Walton, Pembrokeshire, Wales
Death: July 21, 1655 (90-99)
Waltwn, Pembrokeshire, South West, Wales

Lord Bruce Ross Myers, I've been following this thread as John Ap Guffudd is connected to me, but my question/concern/observation here is about your sources listed. I use Family Search all the time for records and citations to link to profiles here and there. It is an amazing site used correctly, but like all others, it can be deflected and unsupported. The links you provided show profiles with no or just a basic source that really doesn't connect Edward past coming over from England.

This link https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/LJGM-31H has really no sources except for some Gedcom data or Ancestry update that we cannot see and an inconsistency that indicates a child was born before the father.

I'm crushed when things don't work out like I thought they were, but I don't see the evidence and that is of course, just my opinion. Best, Susanne

Sgt. John Griffin of Simsbury. has nothing to do with this, are you serious you trying to relate to someone else, has anyone even read that article of Theresa Griffin's extensively researched and sourced discussion of the origins of Edward Griffin and the myths which have been associated with the Griffin family. Edward Griffin, son of John ap Gruffudd (Pengruffwnd) and Ann Langford died by 1622 in England. Ya but no, this John of Simsbury has nothing to do with this family. Sure you don't have your families crossed, and ya searching in the wrong area lol.

His brother John in the the ship Constant. He entered the service of Capt. William Claybourne and was captured on Palmer's Island in 1638 by soldiers of Lord Baltimore.

Edward Griffin, Sr., of Flushing MP
Gender: Male
Birth: 1602
Walton, Pembroke, Wales
Death: 1698 (95-96)
Flushing, Queens, New York, British America

He didn't die before 1635

Sgt. John Griffin, of Simsbury MP
Gender: Male
Birth: September 1608
Wales, United Kingdom
Death: August 23, 1681 (72)
Simsbury, Hartford County, Connecticut Colony

He didn't die before 1635 either, where ya looking or you reading the article of just copy paste, don't mess with my family lineage plase put itm back the way you had it please, these article have no marit and the story that they don't match is right but ya goit crossed bud, and different land in question, I don't have time for this, I have more important things to do than prove my family lineage, you can't change the past or manipulate the real life history, sorry bud but this lineage is solid and has nothing to do with this, Simbury guy, lol, and

Erica Howton,

can't believe you would rely on this person assumptions to have the true, and thank you, to him for that?

Tamás Flinn Caldwell-Gilbert thank you.

I’ve disconnected Edward Griffin, Sr., of Flushing Jasper Griffing, of Southold & Sgt. John Griffin, of Simsbury as children of John ap Gruffudd (Pengruffwnd) - and as brothers to each other, which they were not. They have nothing to do with my lineage, my Simsbury, hello. I am wondering if this or the curators and the background that we are so smart, we try our best but ya can't mess with the royalty tree lineage please, I have more important things to do than trying to find facts to support this ladies story that has no relation to my family, sup

This is the truth and Bob's your uncle, hope that helps to put my lineage back into the way it was, and we not to mess with the lineages so we can't find our home, I am the king of kings, please. Can't mess with the truth, I am connected with everyone that has to do with this and how it operates, I am the connected one, the mix of the bloodlines, I am the true blood of all the famous people and inventors, they are all my family, and if you are not connected to me, then you are not of us, or have any say on the matter, as Mohamed Ali as my bloodlines from North Africa, I am the true blood. Mom and dad to all the royalty tree of Mercia

Can't believe you would think so highly of her, wow, that is a totally different area of Griffin, lol, Sgt. John Griffin of Simsbury, About twenty households, scattered over a 10 mile stretch along both sides of the Farmington River, made up the frontier settlement of Massaco in 1668, this is not the family in question, wow,

I have the TRUE LINEAGE TO THE KINGS

Please keep coming back time after time to remind us how much you don’t have the time

Lord Bruce Ross Myers, most everyone on this thread has multiple "lineage to the kings," if you believe it. Once you get this far removed, it is just a box on the tree. Trick is, is it the right box? The quest for truth is ever present.

From http://freepages.rootsweb.com/~theresagriffin/genealogy/debunkingwe...

Dr. Siddons’ contention was borne out on page 15 of Zeno’s manuscript The Lineage of Richard Griffith, which was taken directly from Burke’s book:

Griffin (Penrith, Wales) Gu. on a fess betw. three lozenges or, each charged with a fleur-de-lis of the first, a demi-rose, betw. two griffins segreant, of the field. [58]

How did this coat of arms come to be part of the Griffin family lore? I have been advised by many genealogists that it was not uncommon for those who immigrated to the colonies to bring coats of arms and family crests with them to elevate themselves in society. This subject and its importance was particularly prevalent in the early years of the twentieth century, where social status was far more important than today. It was clear that not all Griffin historians were convinced about the ownership of these arms. As early as 1924, Justus Griffin voiced his doubts about his family’s ownership of this coat of arms. On page 10 of his book, after discussing a silver plate engraved with the coat of arms described above, which was owned by a descendant of Jasper Griffing, he wrote:

Some of the descendants of Edward Griffin, of Flushing, have convinced themselves that he also was of the family which bore those arms, and made use of them. Whether that is a fact or not is of little consequence now, and the arms are shown here as an interesting relic. [19]

At this point, we have substantial proof that the coat of arms which William Crozier attributed to Sgt. John Griffin of Simsbury, belongs to the Parry family, and therefore, the descendants of Edward Griffin in America and Canada cannot rightfully claim or use these arms. [55] {59}

http://freepages.rootsweb.com/~theresagriffin/genealogy/debunkingwe...

Debunking the Published Griffin Family Myths:
Edward Griffin of Flushing was not Edward Pengruffwnd (Pengriffin)
of Walton West, Pembrokeshire, Wales

Summary

The following work details the results of eleven years of research on the life and times of Edward Griffin who was born about 1602, somewhere in Britain, who arrived in Virginia late in 1635 or early in 1636 aboard the vessel Abraham, and who died after 1698, in Flushing, New York.

For those simply interested in the outcome of this research, I offer the following four assertions; the remainder of this account reveals the circumstances which lead to my conclusions, as well as a list of my supporting references. The sources are bracketed [ ] and the notes are braced { } for convenience.

Please cite my work if you use it. You are welcome to use any of the information here for your personal use; commercial use is not granted.

1. Neither Edward Griffin nor Sgt. John Griffin of Simsbury, Connecticut, was related to the Pengruffwnd/Pengriffin family of Walton West, Pembrokeshire, Wales. The man who was born Edward Pengruffwnd (Griffith/Griffin) was dead by 1622, and his brother, John Griffith, died in 1624. [1] [2]

2. Edward Griffin of Flushing, and Sgt. John Griffin of Simsbury, were not brothers and did not share a common blood relative within the past 10,000 years. There is solid DNA evidence (12 samples) that not only disproves their relationship, but clearly shows they had different haplogroups. [3]

3. Jasper Griffing of Southold, also did not share a common blood relative with Edward Griffin within the past 10,000 years. There is solid DNA evidence to prove this assertion, though I have not thoroughly investigated his potential relationship with Sgt. John Griffin of Simsbury. [4]

4. The coat of arms attributed to the descendants of Edward Griffin, Sgt. John Griffin, and Jasper Griffing, was actually awarded to Griffin Appenreth, of Calais, who died in 1553, leaving no male heirs. No American or Canadian Griffins have rights to the following coat-of-arms, family crest, or motto:

Gu[les] on a fesse betw[een] three lozenges or, each charged with a fleur-de-lis of the first, a demi-rose betw[een] two griffins, segreant of the field/ of the first
Crest – A griffin segreant
Motto – Semper paratus [5] [6] [7] [8]

I welcome any additions, corrections, questions and alternative theories. This is an ongoing project, and will be amended as new information is found. Despite my best efforts to accurately record my findings, I realize I may have made errors and welcome your comments. Before contacting me, I ask only that you read the following rationale, as your questions may have been answered below.

Theresa Griffin

Lord Bruce Ross Myers The issue at the heart of this problem is that Edward Griffin of Flushing and John Griffin of Simsbury (whom you are descended from) have been commonly associated with two brothers listed in Lewys Dwnn's 1613 Heraldic Visitation of Wales. This is the Pengruffwnd family. What Theresa Griffin's research shows is that the John and Edward listed in that visitation died long before your ancestors came to the Americas, therefore they cannot be the same people.

Also, Theresa Griffith demonstrates that the detailed biographies that you listed for Edward Griffith of Flushing are simply constructed from compilations of random mentions of Edward Griffins in English historical documents, without any evidence they they refer to the same person.

If you have evidence that counters Theresa Griffin's research then please put it forward. By evidence I mean primary sources (not internet family trees) that directly links Edward Griffin of Flushing, NY or John Griffin of Simsbury to a specific Edward or John Griffin in England/Wales.

Lord Bruce Ross Myers
We are cousins, 11th I think. I, too, have multiple lineages that lead back to the nobility of long ago. I feel your pain, watching your tree get chopped here and there. I just lost a connection to King David...(Lol, curators) What I realized is that the curators are amazing and extremely capable. They have access to much more information than I do! I trust them to be careful, and to listen when I disagree. If we can't provide acceptable primary sources, which is what I believe they are asking you for, then it is really up to us to prove our connections.
My suggestion is to view this as a learning experience. Despite your lineage, you don't "work for" Geni like the curators and some of the more learned pros do. They have guidelines to follow. It's not an insult to you, it's just the way they have found to keep the tree as accurate as possible, probably an impossible task, but a goal to be pursued in this monumental endeavor. I also understand that there is a tendency in all of us to take this personally. I'm sure you have much documentation and a private tree? Don't rely on Geni to prove or disprove your claims. Continue to work on your private tree and use Geni as a resource. If you and your family have proof of your claims, then be happy! Some people are descendents and don't even know it, and most of us can't prove it beyond the shadow of a doubt. I have trees every where, and they evolve and change over time just like any other living thing. What we think we know is most assuredly going to change over time. Knowledge is not a static thing. It grows and changes. Example: the Flat Earth Theory. Any monumental endeavor requires an empirical approach, and the information on Geni is supported by empirical data/documentation.
I love this site the reams of information that is available at a keystroke. I find the discussions lively and rigorous. What I don't like is the bitterness and insults.I can bring out the worst in some of us. We are all in the game called life together. Let's not forget that we are all brothers and sisters of. We are all related, Kings and Criminals, plague victims and coal miners. Good luck to you, cousin, on your journey of discovery.
Joni

Lol, I think I meant "IT", not "I" When I said, 'I' instead of " 'It' brings out the worst in some of us..."
Made me laugh. Thought I'd share.

I caught that, Joni. Made me laugh, too.

Joni Danielle Sneed, BSN, RN, well said, cousin! Susanne

Oh, it explains and I can't believe you and your words, This is unreal, you had this on Geni, someone put it here and you are still telling me that this lady, has been in the wrong tree and you are blind, you know nothing, why are you a creator, this is not right, I will not stand by your beliefs system, sad to say you stand by lies and the system is telling the truth, I will stand by what the knowledge is true, and it was here, you down the merit of others I can say the same-thing about the facts in your evidence is not enough to over turn the original person that was in there before you changed it, was right, and anyway Thanks Joni for your thoughts, I am and i will keep many things a secret, the documents that he refers too are not facts it is just what the people think, there is no facts to the words on the document, and he doesn't even have the jull to say he is wrong, fighting the truth, will bring Karma to him, I see no truth in the documents that he said, and he even copied and pasted it in the profiles are a wrong influence of writers and our own is the only writers of the family, no some guy that decides to delete some info and put some other hear say, no facts, back your document uyp, the referrals you have in the document at the end are meaningless, lets see some facts of the person not someone making up what they beleive is right, looks good on paper, but no, YOU ARE WRONG, cause of you I deleted all the information to help yo NOT FIND MY PATH, I have all the proof I need to support what you did to my family tree, That is not your family tree to modify only the people in that direct tree can have the authority, I TAKE YOUR AUTHORITY, AND I WANT YOU TO NOT HAVE A SAY YOU HAVE NO AUTHORITY IN MY FAMILY TREE, DON'T TOUCH THE LINEAGE, WHAT WAS THERE PUT IT BACK, please, you are a stubborn one, you can't see the truth looking at it, deFacto is the only way to fly, I wish you noting on my tree to banish you from any modifications on this tree. Who is laughing at who? At me for peaking my mind and I am the only one that is connected to the system that runs this world, tell me you are related to everyone I follow, then we can talk