Natronai Ibn Habibai, Exilarch of Pumbeditha & Almeria - Source for Natronai's connection to Narbonne?

Many sources about these profiles are possible to be found in a book of professor Arthur J. Zuckerman:"A Jewish Princedom in Feudal France 768-900" by Columbia University Press, New York and London, 1972
Best regards,
Paolo G.Amerighi

Private User There's a lot of work out there that disproved Zuckerman's book. Basically he interpreted a bunch of texts the way he wanted to, and ignored anything that contradicted his interpretation. See the wikipedia article above. There's also a lot of academic work on this.

One example review: https://www.jstor.org/stable/4466769?seq=1 (partially paywalled, unfortunately)

@Jeremy Richard LICHTMAN, Unlukely I could not have access into Jstore, however I need to ask if did you read this book to have your own opinion? The notes with the sources in this book, are very important.
I am a direct descendant in masculine lineage of Teudoric l, count of Autun and I did the FTDNA BigY700 and I was invited to be part of two Jewish projects in FTDNA, I think that I will partecipate to understand better

I have read parts of the book.

I have also gone to the original sources - there's only 4 or 5 actual physical documents that mention Isaac the Jew at all (and I think only 2 from during his lifetime). They're all well known documents, and there are scans available online, as well as translations. None of them mention his parents (or any other family for that matter).

The academic consensus today is the Zuckerman fabricated the whole thing.

There's a bit more info about Isaac here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abul-Abbas

Also, if you register on jstor, that url is free to view online. The author goes through Zuckerman's book source by source.

I've managed to download the review and have placed it temporarily on Google Drive here: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1yArNBmXyZVkUUrJlT8yx9DAfEpR...

In summary:

* There was a historical person called Natronai from Bagdhad who was exiled to what is today Tunisia, and likely died there.
* There was probably a Jewish community leader in Narbonne called Makhir.
* There was a Christian leader called Theodoric.

These are three separate people, living in different places, and their lives may not even totally overlap.

Then, there's a diplomat of some sort by the name of Isaac, a generation or so later, who probably was not from Narbonne, and about whom there is no family info known at all.

Origin of the Surname Maldonado descend from the House of David and Nenimiah and Natronai not Bostonai Exilarchs
Makhir ben Yehudah Zakkai of Narbonne or Makhir ben Habibai of Narbonne or Natronai ben Habibi from Aldana Syria. B Rh negative carriers and HLA-A2901 from Ur of Chaldea.

Origin of the Surname Maldonado descend from the House of David and Nenimiah and Natronai not Bostonai Exilarchs
Makhir ben Yehudah Zakkai of Narbonne or Makhir ben Habibai of Narbonne or Natronai ben Habibi from Aldana Syria. B Rh negative carriers and HLA-A2901 from Ur of Chaldea.

hat I have been told is that there were two male dominant lines in ancient Israel: the priestly Aaronic lines (corresponding largely to Hg J2's) and the descendents of David, the "princely line", corresponding to certain G's. Who can confirm or disconfirm this?

Makhir ben Yehudah Zakkai of Narbonne or Makhir ben Habibai of Narbonne or Natronai ben Habibi (725 - 765 CE or 793 CE) was a Babylonian-Jewish scholar and later, the supposed leader of the Jewish community of Narbonne in a region which at that time was called Septimania at the end of the eighth century.
More from Jewish Encyc. through wikipedia:
NATRONAI BEN ḤAVIVAI
NATRONAI BEN ḤAVIVAI (Zavinai ; second half of eighth century), exilarch in Babylonia and pupil of R. *Yehudai Gaon. R. *Sherira relates in his epistle (Iggeret Rav Sherira Ga'on, ed. Lewin (1921), 104) that in the year 1082 of the Seleucid era (771) a conflict over the exilarchate broke out between Natronai and Zakkai b. Aḥunai, who had already occupied this position for a number of years. R. Malkha b. R. Aḥa, the Gaon of Pumbedita, supported Natronai, but both yeshivot supported Zakkai b. Aḥunai. When R. Malkha died, Natronai was compelled to leave Babylonia. He then traveled to the Maghreb (or Spain). According to Spanish tradition, Natronai prepared from memory a copy of the Babylonian Talmud for the Spanish Jews. It is possible that Natronai was the grandfather of Natronai, the exilarch in Babylonia after 857.

bibliography:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Makhir_of_Narbonne

Makhir of Narbonne was a Babylonian-Jewish scholar who settled in Narbonne, France, at the end of the eighth century and whose descendants were for many generations the leaders of that important community.

Contents
1 Writings by Abraham ibn Daud
2 The Bnei Makhir and the Carolingian dynasty

Writings by Abraham ibn Daud

According to a tradition preserved by Abraham ibn Daud in his Sefer ha-Qabbalah Makhir was a descendant of the house of David. Ibn Daud wrote:

Then King Charles sent to the King of Baghdad [Caliph] requesting that he dispatch one of his Jews of the seed of royalty of the House of David. He hearkened and sent him one from there, a magnate and sage, Rabbi Makhir by name. And [Charles] settled him in Narbonne, the capital city, and planted him there, and gave him a great possession there at the time he captured it from the Ishmaelites [Arabs]. And he [Makhir] took to wife a woman from among the magnates of the town; *...* and the King made him a nobleman and designed, out of love for [Makhir], good statutes for the benefit of all the Jews dwelling in the city, as is written and sealed in a Latin charter; and the seal of the King therein [bears] his name Carolus; and it is in their possession at the present time. The Prince Makhir became chieftain there. He and his descendants were close [inter-related] with the King and all his descendants.

Although this relation between Makhir and Charlemagne is probably legendary, it is a fact that the Makhir family enjoyed for centuries many privileges and that its members bore the title of "nasi" (prince). Benjamin of Tudela, who visited Narbonne in 1165, speaks of the exalted position occupied by the descendants of Makhir, and the "Royal Letters" of 1364 [1] also record the existence of a Jewish "king" at Narbonne. The place of residence of the Makhir family at Narbonne was designated in official documents as "Cortada Regis Judæorum" [2]. Makhir is said to have founded a Talmudic school there which vied in greatness with those of Babylonia and which attracted pupils from many distant points.

The Bnei Makhir and the Carolingian dynasty

Some scholars, among them Arthur Zuckerman, maintain that Makhir was actually identical with Natronai ben Habibi, an exilarch deposed and exiled in a dispute between two branches of the family of Bostanai in the late eighth century. Natronai proposed that Makhir Natronai adopted the Frankish name of Aymery or Theodoric (and the title Count of Septimania) and married Alda or Aldana, a daughter of Charles Martel. Aldana's son by Aymery was William of Gellone, about whom there were at least six major epic poems composed before the era of the crusades, including Willehalm, by Wolfram von Eschenbach, the most famous of the mediaeval Grail chroniclers.
Writings by Abraham ibn Daud
According to a tradition preserved by Abraham ibn Daud in his Sefer ha-Qabbalah, written about 1161, Makhir was a descendant of the house of David. Ibn Daud wrote:

Then King Charles sent to the King of Baghdad [Caliph] requesting that he dispatch one of his Jews of the seed of royalty of the House of David. He hearkened and sent him one from there, a magnate and sage, Rabbi Makhir by name. And [Charles] settled him in Narbonne, the capital city, and planted him there, and gave him a great possession there at the time he captured it from the Ishmaelites [Arabs]. And he [Makhir] took to wife a woman from among the magnates of the town; *...* and the King made him a nobleman and designed, out of love for [Makhir], good statutes for the benefit of all the Jews dwelling in the city, as is written and sealed in a Latin charter; and the seal of the King therein [bears] his name Carolus; and it is in their possession at the present time. The Prince Makhir became chieftain there. He and his descendants were close [inter-related] with the King and all his descendants.

Origin of the Surname Maldonado

The Maldonado surname comes from the ancient and noble Galician lineage of Aldana. Aldana's lineage comes from Theodoric, King of the Ostrogoths.

This king was a member of the lineage of the Amalos, (who faced the Huns). Theodoric was the son of Theodomir who was proclaimed King by the Oriolans thus forming the Kingdom of Todmir.

Theodoric in the year 462 was taken to Rome, where he was educated. Relations with the Visigoths were intense when Theodoric became the tutor of Amalric, who would become the king of Spain. In his last years, Theodoric was active in the crusades. On the death of Theodoric, the division of the Gothic kingdom and the Visigoths took place.

Theodoric ruled Spain around the year 507, he left two sons in Spain. One of them was Severiano, Duke of Cartagena, married to Doña Teodora. The other, who was called Suero, made his seat in Galicia and founded the site of the Aldana house there , near the city of Santiago de Compostela. Where the apostle Santiago preached, a disciple of Jesus Christ, converting Spain to Catholicism. Even in the Church of Santiago de Compostela is the tomb of the apostle.

Another legend makes him a trunk with King Ariamiro or Artamiro VIII, monarch of the Swabians in Galicia in 517. The truth is that the Aldana were initially united with that of Arias, formed by the nobleman Arias de Aldana and that Don Hernan Perez de Aldana, Lord of Aldana, who founded the surname of Maldonado during the reign of Alfonso VIII. The Aldana, occupied preeminent positions and carried the titles of Counts in Castile and Leon, later passing to Galicia, Castile, Catalonia, Valencia, Murcia, Extremadura and other regions.

The knights of the Aldana surname acquired great celebrity in the conquest of Valencia, especially mentioning Don Alonso de Aldana, who was given a sword by King Don Jaime I as a reward for his exploits.

The Coat of Arms of Aldana: In a field of gules, five fleurs-de-lis. In a field of gold, two purple wolves.

Don Hernán Pérez de Aldana, Lord of Aldana, was the first to be called Maldonado, during the reign of King Alfonso VIII of Castile. Maldonado or Lord of Aldana related Al-Dana, Syria they were Assyrian-Iraqi Jews or Exilarch NATRONAI BEN ḤAVIVAI
NATRONAI BEN ḤAVIVAI (Zavinai ; second half of eighth century), exilarch in Babylonia and pupil of R. *Yehudai Gaon. R. *Sherira relates in his epistle (Iggeret Rav Sherira Ga'on, ed. Lewin (1921), 104) that in the year 1082 of the Seleucid era (771) a conflict over the exilarchate broke out between Natronai and Zakkai b. Aḥunai, who had already occupied this position for a number of years. R. Malkha b. R. Aḥa, the Gaon of Pumbedita, supported Natronai, but both yeshivot supported Zakkai b. Aḥunai. When R. Malkha died, Natronai was compelled to leave Babylonia. He then traveled to the Maghreb (or Spain). According to Spanish tradition, Natronai prepared from memory a copy of the Babylonian Talmud for the Spanish Jews. It is possible that Natronai was the grandfather of Natronai, the exilarch in Babylonia after 857. A true Messiah can and will delivery both Jesus Christ and Virgin all the Jews out of Babyonlian Captivity. Although some Jews have Stockholms Syndrome or Munchausen Sydrome by proxy which they have fallen in love with their Babylonian Captives