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Janet MacLeod (McDonald) - What is the source data for the profile "Janet MacLeod (McDonald)?

Started by private on Thursday, June 27, 2019
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  • Margaret Macdonald
    Geni member
  • From pages 250-251 of the History of the Macleods, which you will find the full text as a PDF in the media section. It indicates Donald Macleod of Bernera was generally spoken as "The Old Trojan" and he was married three times. Donald Macleod of Bernera was generally spoken as "The Old Trojan" and he was married three times as follows: Wife #1: Anne. Page 250 reads, "Donald married, first, when only 18 years of age, Anne, daughter of Roderick Macleod, XVII. of Macleod, by his wife Isabel, daughter of Kenneth, third Earl of Seaforth, by his wife, also Isabel, sister of George, first Earl of Cromarty." Wife #2: Margaret Macdonald. Page 253 reads" "He married, secondly, Margaret Macdonald, described as "a daughter of John Macdonald Gorm Macdonald of Sleat." They lived together for nineteen years, without issue." Wife #3: Margaret, daughter of Rev. Donald Macloed, III, Of Greshornish. Page 253 reads: "Donald Macleod of Bernera married, thirdly, in the 75th year of his age, Margaret, daughter of the Rev. Donald Macleod, III. of Greshornish, and minister of Duirinish. She was then only sixteen years of age. By this marriage Donald had issue, in his old age—three sons and six daughters.
    Donald 'Old Trojan' Macleod
    Geni member

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private
6/27/2019 at 3:02 PM

What is the source data for the profile "Janet MacLeod (McDonald)? I see no citations, and Janet is not listed in the THE HISTORY OF THE MACLEODS, which is available in the media section of Donald "Old Trojan" MacLeod (aka. Donald Macloed of Bernera).

THE HISTORY OF THE MACLEODS describes only three wives of Donald Macloed of Bernera, aka Donald "Old Trojan" MacLeod
Donald 'Old Trojan' Macleod

Donald Macloed of Bernera / Donald "Old Trojan" MacLeod's wives are described as follows:

Wife #1: Anne, daughter of Roderick Macleod, XVII. Page 250 reads, "Donald married, first, when only 18 years of age, Anne, daughter of Roderick Macleod, XVII. of Macleod, by his wife Isabel, daughter of Kenneth, third Earl of Seaforth, by his wife, also Isabel, sister of George, first Earl of Cromarty."

Wife #2: Margaret Macdonald, John Macdonald Gorm Macdonald of Sleat. Page 253 reads "He married, secondly, Margaret Macdonald, described as "a daughter of John Macdonald Gorm Macdonald of Sleat." They lived together for nineteen years, without issue."

Wife #3: Margaret, daughter of Rev. Donald Macloed, III, Of Greshornish. Page 253 reads: "Donald Macleod of Bernera married, thirdly, in the 75th year of his age, Margaret, daughter of the Rev. Donald Macleod, III. of Greshornish, and minister of Duirinish. She was then only sixteen years of age. By this marriage Donald had issue, in his old age—three sons and six daughters."
Anne Brannen C
6/27/2019 at 10:05 PM

She can be found on the macleodgenealogy.org Site; the reference given is

Sir Robert Douglas of Glenbervie, Baronet, THE BARONAGE OF SCOTLAND, Edinburgh, 1798, p. 382.

Doesn’t look like there is an etext available.

The McDonald wife is mentioned, though no first name is given, in “The Brave Sons of Skye” https://books.google.com/books?id=IRo9AAAAYAAJ&pg=PA120&lpg.... — John McInnes, 1899

So nothing there as to either Janet or Margaret.

Where either of those names came in from isn’t stated.

But at any rate. She hasn’t been made up out of whole cloth. Both she and Margaret show up in histories. Janet is in the earlier one. Would be nice to see that text, to see if there is evidence for the name. There isn’t any in the History of the MacLeod text (which is from the middle of the 19th century).

And of course. This is late enough that the second wife may be Janet Margaret.

private
6/28/2019 at 7:09 AM

Anne THANK YOU SO MUCH for all the data above! I will hunt the BARONAGE OF SCOTLAND and review macleodgenealogy.org.

Incidentally, I've captured the PDF for my records.
The History of Macleods, printed in 1899
The Brave Sons of Skye, printed in 1899

Regarding the theory that the second wife would be Janet Margaret, it should be known that from this union there ws no issue ~ eg no kids, so no parentage of Capt. Donald MacLeod by Wife #2.

Regarding Capt. Donald MacLeod...
He was child #22 by parentage of wife #3 Margaret who was 16 when she was married and who had from this union= for the old trojan three sons and six daughters.

"22. Captain Donald Macleod, who commanded an East Indiaman. He married Miss Gigurnet, daughter of an Attorney in Cheltenham, with issue—an only son, who died young."

FROM: Pages 250-255 of the History of the Mcleods.

private
6/28/2019 at 7:58 AM

Dear https://www.geni.com/people/Tamás-Caldwell-Gilbert/6000000001654183... and Anne Brannen

Margaret Macdonald is NOT mentioned on page 381 of the BARONAGE OF SCOTLAND
https://play.google.com/books/reader?id=wapeAAAAcAAJ&hl=en&...

BY SIR ROBERT DOUGLAS OF GLENBERViE, BARONET. 1798.

Also, the book is available online.
Anne Brannen C
6/28/2019 at 8:17 AM

Yes, p. 382 gives Margaret, not Janet. So the info that's been copied from macleodgenealogy is copying a miscopying.

private
6/28/2019 at 9:01 AM

Please look again, Anne, and clarify for me?

Page 381-381 references NORMAN MCLEOD.
“Norman Mcloed of Bernera, Muiravenside, third son of Roderick of that ilk.”

My conclusion: there's no proof of Janet MacLeod (McDonald) and of the relationships ascribed. We must disconnect the profile.

Consensus? Better theory? I'm open!
Erica Howton C
6/29/2019 at 6:26 PM

I’d rather merge Janet into Margaret and list Janet in AKA

private
6/29/2019 at 6:52 PM

Erica, what proof do we have that she was ever called "Janet"?

* There are no Janet McDonald's in THE HISTORY OF MACLEOD.
* There are two listed for Janet MacDonald in the in THE HISTORY OF MACLEOD
#1: Wife of Norman Mcleod" Norman was separated from his wife, Janet Macdonald, of Sleat, for several years, during which time, we are informed, " he took a fancy to a pretty girl " named Ann Martin. He is said to have sent his wife a kind letter, after many years of separation, inviting- her back to Dunvegan. She returned, and soon after was reported dead. He then married, as his second wife, this Ann, daughter of William Martin, of Inchfure, described as " Mrs. Ann Martin," and by her he had issue Pages 153-154

#2: Wife of John Macleod: "Captain John Macleod, of Ollach, who married Janet Macdonald, of Dunskellar, North Uist, with issue, page 393

WHY MERGE? There are no facts or sources listed in the media for Janet MacLeod (McDonald). Absent of any citations, the profile Janet MacLeod (McDonald) is a candidate for disconnecting from unsourced relations.
Anne Brannen C
6/29/2019 at 7:34 PM

We often put variant names, such as people are found by if you go looking for them, in the “nickname” field. Whether or not she was ever called Janet in her life, clearly she shows up as Janet on some websites. So she needs to be findable.
Erica Howton C
6/29/2019 at 8:22 PM

It’s untidy to leave floaters around to confuse people, and there is a citation people will follow calling her Janet.

It’s really not an unusual scenario and the AKA field solves it.
Erica Howton C
6/29/2019 at 8:25 PM

private This is not the only source covering the MacLeod’s, Anne had tracked down the origin of the Janet Name - a Mis transcription in a respected published source. So we add the citation to the Master Profile and explain the variant name. The “relationships” are the same in all the source data I’ve seen so far.

private
6/29/2019 at 11:28 PM

Erica, I'll hunt for Anne's information, but I wanted to let you know...

Donald "Old Trojan" MacLeod / Donald Macloed of Bernera had 29 children and they are not yet attached to this profile! See pages 250 -255 of THE HISTORY OF THE MACLEODS in the media section.

The children of Donald "Old Trojan" MacLeod / Donald Macloed of Bernera include:

1. Norman Macleo
3. Roderick Macleod.
4. William Macleod.
5. John Macleod.
6. A Janet,
7. Isabella
8. Christian
9 Daughter who married Macleod of Ferrinlea
10: Sibella
11. Flora
12. A daughter who married Maclean of Trean.
13 A daughter who married Major Macdonald of Acha goyle.
14-20 Not Known
21. Lieutenant-General Sir John Macleod
22. Captain Donald Macleod,
23. Lieutenant-General Sir Charles Macleod
24. Alexandrina
26. Marion
27. Jessie
28. Christina
29. Another daughter, who died in infancy
Erica Howton C
6/29/2019 at 11:38 PM

private Is anything stopping you from adding children ? Go ahead, you have good references. Also, if you can’t easily find the wives parents, it’s fine to make new profiles and we can merge. I’m pretty sure the Earl of Seaforth is on Geni but I wouldn’t vouch for the others.
Erica Howton C
6/29/2019 at 11:44 PM

Oh, something I’ve been meaning to mention. Scots women were known by their father’s surname at both birth and death in records (Birth surname field and last name field in Geni). You’ll find them informally referred to, at times, as Mrs so & so, but records are clear: their last known last names are the same as their first known last names.

Unlike England.

private
6/30/2019 at 12:02 AM

With time I can add the names, but I am concerned for the moment about JANET. There was a profile floating out there and I'll need to take a look at another time.

Janet is not a sourced husband of Donald "Old Trojan" MacLeod / Donald Macloed of Bernera; however there is a Janet who was the 6th child.

See pages 250 -255 of THE HISTORY OF THE MACLEODS in the media section.
Erica Howton C
6/30/2019 at 12:15 AM

That’s already been resolved. Janet is given as the name in a respected source: we’re going with Margaret as her name and Janet in AKA, and it’s been described in the “about.”

private
6/30/2019 at 11:03 AM

Actually your Second Wife "Janet" source is blank:
http://www.macleodgenealogy.com/ACMS/D0047/I621.html

This could be a transcription error?

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