Hugh Barnard Zichy Nankivell writes:
I am somewhat confused in respect of part of your data base and in respect of some of the dates shown in your data base.
It is hard to know where to start, but I will start with Frances Babthorpe's husband Thomas Yorke of Parceval Hall, Burnsall''s parents, Peter Yorke of Gouthwaite and Elizabeth Ingleby of Ripley Castle.
After quite some research, it appears that Peter Yorke and Elizabeth Ingleby were married during November 1560, that their eldest child and eldest son, Sir John Yorke of Gouthwaite was born in 1561.
It appears that Thomas Yorke, husband of first Frances Vavasour of Spadington, Yorkshire (who died without children), and husband of second Frances Babthorpe, was the second child and second son of Peter Yorke and Elizabeth Ingleby. This Thomas Yorkeappears to have been born between 1562 and 1566, as his next younger brother, Richard Yorke was born in about 1567-1568. You have this Thomas Yorke as having been born in about 1540.
I will be most grateful if you will have another look at this Thomas Yorke's date of nirth, bearing in mind the date of his parents' marriage. (I have Thomas Yorke's father, Peter Yorke, as having been born in about 1525, and Thomas Yorke's mother, Elizabeth Ingleby, as having been born in 1544.)
It appears that Thomas Yorke's first wife, Frances Vavasour died not long after her marriage to Thomas Yorke. Frances Vavasour was a daughter of Sir George Vavasour of Spaldington, Yorkshire, and Catherine Babthorpe, a daughter of Sir William Babthorpe of Babthorpe and Osgodby and his wife Barbara Constable of Everingham, Yorkshire. This Catherine Babthorpe subsequently married, after the death of Sir George Vavasour, John Ingleby of Ripley Castle, Ripley, Yorkshire
Sincerely. This John Ingleby was a son son Sir William Ingleby of Ripley Castle and Anne 'Mary' Mallory of Studley, Yorkshire, and a brother of Elizabeth Ingleby who married Peter Yorke referred to above. All this is mentioned so as to give a better background and chronological context.
You have Thomas Yorke's second wife, Frances Babthorpe, as being a daughter of Sir William Babthorpe of Babthorpe and Osgodby (about 1580-1635) and Grace (or Ursula) Tyrwhitt (?-1635) who married on 12th. January 1578 At Ripley, Yorkshire, and who did have a daughter Frances Babthorpe (1604-1658), but she became a Nun at a young age and remained a Nun all her life. She was a Nun in a Convent in what is now Belgium. In my view, chronologically, this Frances Babthorpe (1604-1658), could not have been the wife of Thomas Yorke, as the Frances Babthorpe who married Thomas Yorke had a son, Sir John Yorke, who was born between 1592 and 1598 - probably about 1592.
It appears to me that the Frances Babthorpe who married Thomas Yorke was in fact a daughter of Sir William Babthorpe of Babthorpe and Osgodby (1529-1581) and his first wife, Barbara Constable of Everingham (1531-17th. October 1564) who married in 15578 at Everingham, Yorkshire, or of this Sir William Babthorpe's (1529-1581) and his second wife Frances Dawnay of Sezay (Sessay), Yorkshire (1540-1605), who married on 17th. October 1564 at Snaith, Yorkshire.
It should be noted however that Sir William Babthorpe (1529-1581) has a full sister, Frances Babthorpe (about 1520-?) who married William Creyke - this Frances Babthorpe does not appear to have had more than one husband. This particular Frances Babthorpe, in my view, could not chronologically or biologically have been the mother of the Sir John Yorke who was born in about 1592-1598 - probably about 1592 to Thomas Yorke and Frances Babthorpe.
From what I have been able to glean from my research, Sir William Babthorpe (1529-1581) and his second wife, Frances Dawnay (1540-1605), had only one child, a daughter, Christiana (Christiana) Babthorpe (1565-1617).
It appear to me that the Frances Babthorpe who married Thomas Yorke as his second wife, was a daughter of Sir William Babthorpe (1529-1581) and his first wife, Barbara Constable (1531-before 17th. October 1564). In my records in respect of this particular matter, which I inherited from my grandmother who in turn inherited them from her grandmother, I have the Frances Babthorpe who married Thomas Yorke, was born in about 1563 in the Parish of Hemingbrough, Yorkshire, and died on 15th. April 1628 at York, Yorkshire.
In support of the view that the Frances Babthorpe who married Thomas Yorke was a daughter of Sir William Babthorpe (1529-1681) and Barbara Constable (1531-before 17th. October 1564), I refer to a book / article published in about 1604 entitled 'The Yorkshire Papists'. In tat book / article, there is reference to John Ingleby and his wife Catherine Babthorpe, and also, in a footnote, to the wife of Thomas Yorke (i.e. Frances Babthorpe) as being a sister of John Ingleby's wife, Catherine Babthorpe.
In the book entitled "Yorke Country" by Anne Ashley Cooper, ISBN 0 9511112 21, on page 91, there is, in my view an error, and also, in my view, an error on page 296 that relates to a footnote on page 91, being footnote 18. Footnote 18 refers to the 'Assheton Journal". I have perused the "Assheton Journal" and came to the view that the author misread the "Assheton Journal" mistook the 'Christiana Babthorpe' referred to in the "Assheton Journal" for the 'Frances Babthorpe' who married Thomas Yorke. Christiana Babthorpe did indeed have a half sister, Catherine Babthorpe, wife of John Inglevy of Ripley Castle. In can find no reference in the "Assheton Journal" to any Frances Babthorpe at all, so I have concluded that the author of "Yorke Country", on page 91 of her book, made a mistake when she said, at page 91, "(Her sister was Mrs. Nicholas Assheton of Down ham, and her half sister was Mrs John Ingleby of Ripley" - i.e. Catherine Ingleby (nee Babthorpe). The Frances Babthorpe who married Thomas Yorke had no sister who was Mrs. Nicholas Assheton of Downham. Nicholas Assheton's mother-in-law was born Christiana (Christiana) Babthorpe.
I will be most grateful if you will consider the above and let me know your thoughts. I will be happy to try to answer any queries that you may have. If, at 'the end of the day' you consider that I am correct in what I have stated above, I will be grateful if you will amend the records in your web site.
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I am grateful for any community assistance on this request.
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