Merging exitsing Public Profiles with more recent Private ones.

I do not think Geni can relax their privacy guidelines, but I can make some arguments to the privatizers.

1. Geni mission is a single family tree of everyone, duplicate profiles are counter this mission and an enormous waste of everyone’s time.

2. Data is public. The information is (usually) easily accessible. So there’s nothing to hide.

3. More intimate family stories can be shared in guestbook memories or family group discussions. No one can see those except family.

4. If keeping photos etc private is the concern, don’t put them on the internet.

5. If it’s about control and who can edit, a private tree on MyHeritage is a better approach.

Thank you for your input on privacy and collaboration Erika.

Privacy or the lack of it.
Much of the information that we should be obliged to conceal under the 150 year ruling is already in the public domain. If it wasn't, we and our Geni collaborators couldn't have found it in the first place. It seems rather unfortunate therefore that we have to either hide even the basic info that we have discovered from others or reveal and be damned. But that's the way it is at present. Most of us opt for a diplomatic compromise,

Collaboration
Geni's policy of fostering collaboration among its members in order to unite a vast number of family trees into a single unit certainly makes sense. As Erika intimates, an individual's wish to preserve duplicate trees and profiles within Geni defeats that aim and is therefore counter productive. I suggest that those who do seek to preserve their own trees without unification to others containing the same family members, must also consider whether it was wise of them to join a collaborative website in the first place.

Whilst the above does not resolve what should be done about merged trees that are presumed to contain identical private and public profiles, it does highlight further problems that all Geni collaborators face.

I can also add a point from my experience as a volunteer curator.

Sometimes there’s a frustration with incorrect data or family relationships, and the reaction is to privatize rather than discuss and correct.

Also, basic or new members may not have the technical rights to disconnect an erroneous profile; understand how to merge a matching profile or tree; how to resolve data conflicts; and how to make notes in profiles so confusing issues are transparent.

Again we have solutions to all of these, and curators are glad to assist with corrections, because the “right” tree benefits everyone.

Ask for curating assistance on the “sticky” discussion, “ATTENTION Curators, please assist”

https://www.geni.com/discussions/178003?msg=1199698

Every Geni member should “follow” and also feel free to jump in & help out.

Genealogy issues are better worked through from profile “discussion” tabs, which results in notifications to that profile followers.

There are some cases where the profile managers are NOT related to the profile and has made them private. This has probably got more to do with control of the profile than privacy.

In the cases where the profile is born within 150 years only a family member within 4th cousins can request them to be public.

Re; Feeling free to jump in & help out.

Everyone on a collaborative website (as Erica puts it) should feel free to jump in & help out, especially if they have access to resources that others do not. Unfortunately, if a profile manager (who may or may not have ancestral ties) has become possessive, they can effectively halt the tree's progression at a point of their choosing by making any key profile within the 150 year time slot, Private. By doing so, they can effectively block any further input from other Geni subscribers.

Leanne has politely intimated, the 150 year rule combined with a privacy setting can now be subtly used by the less collaborative to effectively control any further input into a communal tree. An example that comes to mind is adding a partner, the partner's parents and any in-laws to a private profile. The only available option at the moment is to create a duplicate less stringent profile to the private one and start a further tree from that point in the hope that the two can eventually be merged later on.

Private User - Geni has changed its promises and functioning repeatedly. The original concept of a "World Tree" that I saw did not include anything at all about Profiles being Public. Rather -- the concept as I saw it described was that as each of us built out, we would overlap the trees of others and eventually a World Tree would be created. But nothing - absolutely nothing - was said about making those Profiles Public.

Geni is not simply about creating a World Tree -- they have always had the goal of a World Tree -- AND the Goal, which they actively encouraged, of Family sharing with Family, complete with info and photos you only wanted shared with family.
This second aspect - Family sharing privately with Family - is still something Geni cares about and is upholding and enforcing -- According to Geni's rules and procedures, not only can we merge profiles (so any duplicate Public Profile you create we can merge into our existing ones) - but we have the right and ability to remove as Manager from any Profile in our Max Family any person who is not within that Profile's Max Family.
So -- My feeling - if you are not in the Profile's Max Family, and others are, and they do not want your help - then butt out; stop trying to work there, and find someplace where your efforts will be appreciated.

regarding the statement above that: " I suggest that those who do seek to preserve their own trees without unification to others containing the same family members, must also consider whether it was wise of them to join a collaborative website in the first place."

Up until less than a week ago, in Geni's Working With The World Tree Project it was clearly stated that "Geni's current policy (2014) is to allow standalone trees for users who want them."
Folks can certainly "consider whether it was wise" for them to accept Geni's previous statements and promises -- but I do not think that is actually what the statement is saying.

Thanks Lois. I was not aware of that.
It does rather contradict Erica's statement regarding the Geni mission of a single family tree for everyone doesn't it? Or is that an ambiguous statement?
Everyone having a single family tree of their own?
Everyone having all their family information on a single tree?

Presumably those trees that which cannot presently be merged, and have had no input whatsoever from any other Geni subscriber are those which fall into the stand alone category. Having them however, reintroduces the old problem (if it is one) of Genii having numerous duplicate trees, a few quite possibly including conflicting profiles that have been poorly researched by the less diligent.

Another complication I can foresee came from some advice I recently received from one of the senior curators of all people. In his opinion, transcribing archival documents is not enough, and we should all strive to become skilled at INTERPRETING them. As we can all interpret things differently, I personally feel doing that would be a recipe for even further conflict and chaos.

Roy -- re: the statement I quoted from The World Tree Project -- possibly the way I phrased it made it seem that was the last time I looked (possibly suggesting it still probably said that) -- rather than reality --- it was changed on 1/23/2019
This is the Project: https://www.geni.com/projects/Working-with-the-World-Tree/12429

As to -- is allowing Separate / Standalone Trees in contradiction to "the Geni mission of a single family tree for everyone" - no, there is not contradiction.

The goal of a World Tree with a Profile on it for everyone now alive and who ever lived with NO DUPLICATES ON THE WORLD TREE is equally consistent with allowing separate trees on Geni and with not -- you don't worry about there are duplicates of folks on MyHeritage Trees, or Ancestry Trees, or Wikii-Tree -- similarly, if Separate Trees are allowed on Geni, one should not worry about any duplicates there --- just worry about duplicates on the World Tree, and getting the World Tree as complete as possible.