John Rice - John Rice aka Perrott Rice 1625 ca. son of Perrott Rice Senior 1600

Hi Dale

Just as a point - the John Rice's of Massachusetts have been accounted for and thus excluded from your inquires.

In looking into postulated "progeny of Perrot ap Rice" arrivers from Wales to the American Colonies (New Netherlands at that time being a Dutch possession) you may want to expand your query to include alternate name spellings, such as Rhys.

The key inclusive criteria MUST be "arriver from Wales," otherwise you will have too many hits.

Thanks, I use my Rhys querry depending on when in time I am looking....Understanding how we came to be connected to that family is my task....So I remain open to the possibilites. It is afterall, my story as recalled by a reliable source which has thus far been corroborated by History. Many, many thanks to three great women here at Geni!

Ms. Erica, i have a question. Not at all a challenge just trying to understand the logic employed by Geni......I see the link to John Rice of Dedham is an LDS site, presumably for his baptismal registration in Berkhamstead Endg that being recorded to ? Edmund and Thomasine? If so is the birth not in question just the Father Status? I can't see the document from here, do you know how to access it, and what does it say about parentage....If Thomasine is the Mother, and Edmund is NOT that Father, that means that Perrott Rice has to be the Father due to the configuration of the sons Y chromosomes.....YES?

I'm not going to address your hypothetical parents, Dale. :)

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Citations

1. Ancestral File number 228X-KS, LDS. christened 1624 in Berkhamstead, Hertfordshire, England.

- this is the "traditional" pedigree submitted information submitted to the LDS. I know that because it is called "the ancestral file.". Now whether that references microfilmed data held in the LDS vaults, or a register report, or a Family Group Sheet, or an index, and what further information might be gleaned from examining that record - I do not know.

However your local Family History Center would be able to further assist you on it. If I were you I would go there, and ask.

So as far as you know then, Edmund is named as the Father and Thomasine would be named mother? We have to remain neutral on Actual Biological FAther since there is disagreement over the DNA signature for John 1625 is how I interpret your response....

As far as I know no one knows the parents of John Rice of Dedham and never have.

I don't know what you mean by Edmund & Thomasine being his parents, I know of no such claim.

But Dale - I do not know what the ancestral file number 228X-KS says. You could look that up on https://familysearch.org/ and extract, download, analyze, etc. for yourself. There are many explanations for their coding.

I am pretty confident the extract is correct and only lists this Christening event.

I would but they wont' let me in.....I have a lot of trouble with their little tests to make sure Im not a robot....no matter how I enter the info it rejects it....Im taking the information from what's been said here that John Rice 1624 was baptised somewhere in Berkhamstead and assigned a Parental note of Edmund and Thomasine Frost....Put that together with my father's statement that Perrott got some one in the FAMILY Way on a visit and you have my thesis for existence...If my DNA markers are not like John RICE I'll have to start over...BUT so far DAd
s tory has proved to be true in every regard...so....fyi

He was NOT assigned a parental role of those two, as far as I know - and in any event it wouldn't matter, as the DNA evidence has excluded John of Dedham as a child of Edmund Rice.

Yes, you do want to look into the study of descendants of John Rice of Dedham the ERA is putting together.

Ask someone else to download the LDS record for you.

Be aware that the LDS database contains many disproven records. There is lots of information on the Internet on how to peruse and analyze their data.

Dale click this link

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.2.1/9MSV-C9W

You will see it's a "user submitted genealogy."

Remember what Kris explained - many older pedigrees erroneously "presumed" John of Dedham was a son of Edmund Rice.

If you looked at the town records I linked in John of Dedham's profile, they never made any such assumption at the time. Those are primary quality records, the LDS record is tertiary at best.

So based on town records, we know that

- the town of Dedham was first settled by 30 families in 1636 from EAST ANGLIA (the other side of England from Wales)
- no Rice is noted among those families
- John Rice married Ann Hackley in 1649
- the births of 5 of their children are recorded
- the marriage of Samuel Rice & Rebecca Miles is recorded
- the birth of Samuel Rice is NOT recorded

I wish I were better at transferring sites to these pages. I just wrote down the description of the Tomb of Margaret Mercer on a site called "Church Book os St. Mary the Virgin" TENBY. Full description and picture of the very large tomb handsomely carved with the full Coat of ARMS for Ap Reese/Mercer/Martin/Marles/ Bateman/ Perrott/Vernaey/ Levelent and Roach....With Daffid Rice a natural son of Sir Rhys ap Thomas and Alswyn or Alsond of Arnold Martin and John Rice & Catherine Perrott. I'll be there in September.

Cool!

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