Hildegard von Vinzgouw - How Should We Record Her Name?

My research on this line is on the Charlemagne Project: http://www.geni.com/projects/Charlemagne-Emperor-of-the-West/1550

- Einhard refers to Hildegard as "de gente Suavorum"

- Thegan's Vita Hludowici Imperatoris names her "Hildigardam quæ erat de cognatione Gotefridi ducis Alamannorum"

- The Annales Laurissenses record the death of "Hildegardis regina

- Paulus Diaconus wrote an epitaph to "Hildegardis regina"
[http://fmg.ac/Projects/MedLands/CAROLINGIANS.htm#_Toc240955192

A long discussion was held to decide on how to record Charlemagne's (Charlemagne) names with Justin Durand,Private User, Private User amongst many others.

I can't find seem to find it right now (perhaps it was before the DIscussion option, & we had it in Messages?) - but much interesting research came to the fore, including an increased awareness that the language in which Chucky himself would have recognized his own name spoken to him, was almost certainly none of the ones that had come down to us in writing. This would apply to Hildegrade too.

Yes, I think leave granny's profile as it is...:)

All names should be listed ,as we are dealing with many of the area of the world and different names are used .Just because, in one country, he goes by one name doesn't mean the rest of the world knows it or uses it.A new comer coming onto Geni might not have any clue what or who the person is if you don't have a name they reaconize . In the English speaking world and most likely French speaking world Charlesmagne would be the name they know him as. Anywhere I've read about him, theynstart with Charlesmagne and list all other names right there with it.

Sharon there was a long disusion on this subject awhile ago. It acutally smi turned nasty, which I won't go into . It must be out there somewhere. I think it happened more then a year ago.

Geni have language dependent names on their work list.
None-native name variants should wait until we get that.

HIldegrard would be listed I would imagine with several names also, Most historiacal people seem to have multi names.

Bjorn, Hun!!!! What list?

I see two different questions. What did she think her name was? And, what should we call her so we know who we're talking about?

She thought her name was Hildegarde. No surname. She was a Queen, of the Franks. And, she was an Empress of the restored Western [Roman] Empire. The Holy Roman Empire did not exist in her lifetime.

She lived before the time of surnames, so we invent surnames for her. In English, she is usually called Hildegarde of Swabia, from Einhard's description "de gente Suavorum", which means "from the family / tribe of Swabia". Sometimes she is called Hildegarde of Alemannia, because her father was Duke of Alemannia. Alemannia is the same as Swabia. Sometimes she is called Hildegarde of Vinzgouw, because her father was Count of Vinzgouw. We now call her father's family the Agilolfinger, so some genealogists call her Hildegarde Agilolfing.

English Wikipedia likes Hildegarde of Vinzgouw. French Wikipedia calls her Hildegard de Vintzgau. German Wikipedia avoids giving her a surname.

In her lifetime it was customary for the wife of a king to be called queen. And, it was recognized that the wife of an emperor was an empress.

There can never be a final, black-and-white answer to what her name should be on Geni. It will always be a matter of personal opinion and personal taste. Anything more that "Queen Hildegarde" (and perhaps "of Swabia") goes beyond the sources and starts inventing or reconstructing data.

When we clean up her name, we need to pay special attention to the AKA field so that we enter as many variations as we find so that everyone on Geni can find her and know who she is.

APPLAUSE from the wings :-)

A reminder on how names work in Geni (as I understand it)

MATCH
first name, birth surname, last name

"simple" SEARCH (the search box)
Any of the values you enter

"advanced" SEARCH (using the filter options on the left)
specific to the values you enter in specific fields

the @ option , also used in messaging
Display name

Google search (using Site: Geni name)
Display name

Hmm I think google search "smarter" than I'm referencing and should give you the Geni profile based on more possibilities than I list.

Great discussion. I leave this to the much more experienced genealogists then myself. Your expertise is amazing.

Google search has no idea what the fields on the Geni page are. They will index all the fields that are visible when they fetch the page.
It's a good thing that "also known as" is visible.

Not correct, - in theory you can use Google to make much better searches than Geni. We just have to figure out how.
Log out of Geni and view how Geni are tagging a profile, and how Google indexes it.

My anser is just record it correctly and reference all know refences to her and anyone else who happens to pop up in the furture do the same. It's not rocket science!Altho sometimes I think some people on Geni try to make it that way!

It';s really far more simple then that. Mountains are being made out mole hills here!

yes i agree with judy there are lots of areas where you need a phd just to use this site!!

Never mind use the site but understanding there statements! You read someof the remarks and you say What! I mean most things could be said much simplier. to the point and shorter!

Example Emperise is not a name/ Ya think! No it's a title. A high title and by the way the French so use Emperor and Emperess. Remember Napolian.!

Amy, weather not a person is English or not, since half the world speak English , maybe more than half the world, don't you thing English should be imcluded in name. Mind you I said included. That's how we have always read it.That's the language we are taught world history in.A good chunk of us only speak and read and write English.Last time I knew that's the main language of Ebgland, Scotland, Northern Island, Austrilia, New Zwwland, Canada, USA, South Africa and a good secrion of India. Anywhere. England or USA have owned at one time or another speaks English.Plus many countried other then those also speak English, maybe not first but they know it.So English sould be included along with other languages.

Titles etc has nothing to do in name fields independent of languages.

According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_total_number_of_s... the number of English speakers (primary and secondary) is estimated between 500 million and 1.5 billion. It's a safe bet to say that the majority of the world does NOT speak English.

It's not even safe to assume that English is the primary secondary language. Chinese may be larger in number of secondary speakers.

"Ebgland, Scotland, Northern Island, Austrilia, New Zwwland"

judy please learn some English...

Miss type and I am speaking English. Born in America of native American and English back ground people who some arr. on the Mayflower . Most arr by 1650. A couple of frenchmen arr later. Sorry honey bun I am speaking English. Never said I could spell. But I do have manners.cuse me Ireland not Island an n on the end of American. Zeeland That's called bad typing and spelling not English. Jason you need to learn maners and the diference between speaking and writing English as to bad spelling and mistyped words and not going back to re check, which I didn't but even if I had noticed I messed up and was able to reconize I miss spelled I might not have been able to fix it.But I think you got the point didn't you,

I looked you up and I see you are from New Zealand and I still spelled it incorrectly and didn't know til I looked you up and saw where you live.

I looked you up and I see you are from New Zealand and I still spelled it incorrectly and didn't know til I looked you up and saw where you live.

I suggested that spell check be added to Geni. This computer won't let me add it. Other computer has it but I don't always have use of it. Basicly, try to live with it. If I fix it I will.

Try this again! Good luck with the name game here. You'll do whatever you want anyway.Just though it would be nice if all names were presented in a way everyone would be happy!